Organic Fertigation?
 

Does anyone grow organically and use a fertilizer injector with a drip system? That is my plan for next year.

I'm thinking about brewing compost tea, filtering it well, and putting it in my ez-flow injector. I can only guess that I would need a chlorine filter, or else the chlorine/chloramine in the tap water would adversely affect my tea. Here's an example: [url]http://www.freshwatersystems.com/c-232-garden-water-filters.aspx[/url]

Molasses is another easy fertilizer to use with the injector. There are plenty of organic over-the-counter hydroponic nutrients, but I think they would be cost-prohibitive. Guano might work, as long as I can filter out the sediment so nothing clogs.

Sounds like a lot of work filtering. Highly filtered organic hydroponic base nutrients like BioBiz, Botanicare or Nectar for the Gods would work but like you said it would get expensive to run it through a drip system to soil.

What crop are you fertilizing?

Tatiana

tomatoes

I think what type of soil and what amendments you have added to it would dictate the amount and frequency of fertigation required. My raised bed at work I added horse manure, horn shavings, azomite and compost last fall and have yet to add anything this year except water and it's a jungle.

If you are growing in containers that is a different story.

Ami

I agree with Ami.
We add alfalfa meal and bone meal before planting, and never fertilize tomatoes throughout the season, unless they are in containers on the balcony (in this case I add alfalfa and compost at the end of July, and water with kelp solution).

It sounds like lots of work filtering.

Tatiana

Cole,Worth in #12 covers some of the aspects you are questioning.A good read all the way around the post also.

[url]http://www.tomatoville.com/showthread.php?t=7489&highlight=chlorine+filter+drip+system[/url]

Also some chlorine items here.

[url]http://www.tomatoville.com/showthread.php?t=16782&highlight=chlorine+filters[/url]

I've been using GHE General Organics this year with good results and don't see any problem using it with a drip system. Hence my question as to the type of aggregate you be growing in.

[url]http://www.amazon.com/General-Hydroponics-Box-Starter-Kit/dp/B004PS4B08/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1406749647&sr=8-1&keywords=GHE+Bio[/url]

Can you really filter enough to not plug your drip tape? We don't even try the organic fertigation due to the particle size and trying to get it through the emitters. IMO fish emulsion will plug the drip tape, I have tried it and it seems to ruin it.. I think your best bet is to amend your soil before planting.

To fertilize it would be better to have larger spray heads or emitters dedicated for this purpose.
Then just use the drip system for watering.

Worth

I run water soluable powders (fish and kelp) thru my drip irrigation for my giant vegetables. Also Companion, Actinovate, Molasses. A number of things. You need to flush the lines out well after you run them thru.

[QUOTE=Worth1;425650]To fertilize it would be better to have larger spray heads or emitters dedicated for this purpose.
Then just use the drip system for watering.

Worth[/QUOTE]

That's the thing, though, doing so would present a host of new problems: getting through plastic mulch, preventing algae growth, and getting the fertilizer water to soak down far enough into the soil without evaporating. I have to use mulch or else I get a weed explosion. The drip tape under plastic is perfect - as long as it doesn't clog.

I can buy screen material in various micron sizes, and experiment to see how much filtering is required. I'm hoping the beneficial bacteria I would be culturing could fit through a screen of very small micron size.

I will be amending my soil with organic fertilizers like rock phosphate over the winter, but from what I understand it takes years to break down. The drip system would very convenient for delivering beneficial bacteria and sugars to feed them.

I dont know a thing about compost tea.
What mesh filter would you need? I use a 200 mesh filter on my drip lines.

Worth

[QUOTE=Cole_Robbie;425666]That's the thing, though, doing so would present a host of new problems: getting through plastic mulch, preventing algae growth, and getting the fertilizer water to soak down far enough into the soil without evaporating. I have to use mulch or else I get a weed explosion. The drip tape under plastic is perfect - as long as it doesn't clog.

I can buy screen material in various micron sizes, and experiment to see how much filtering is required. I'm hoping the beneficial bacteria I would be culturing could fit through a screen of very small micron size.

I will be amending my soil with organic fertilizers like rock phosphate over the winter, but from what I understand it takes years to break down. The drip system would very convenient for delivering beneficial bacteria and sugars to feed them.[/QUOTE]

I posted right after you did.
When I get home we can surely come up with something.
I have an idea that may work but posting on this phone is a challenge and I need to draw some sort of prints to show you and others what I have in mind.
The plastic mulch kills the two line idea.:lol:
What is your drip line.
Worth

[I]The plastic mulch kills the two line idea.

[/I]hmmm. Maybe not. What if I ran a piece of pvc pipe down the row, and then tapped into it with black spaghetti tubing? I could put an emitter on the end of the tubing and then stick it under the plastic. It would be easy to pull it up and check for clogs. I can even feel the wet spots through the plastic if I need to.

I think molasses would run through the injector and drip tape just fine. I would have to find the specs on the package to see if they tell you anything about the hole size. I can buy a multi-pack of screens sold as pollen separators to experiment with screening.

I think I'd need a pump to create a small amount of pressure to fill the pvc lines, but I think a simple transfer pump would do the job. I even have one.

Thanks for the help, Worth and everyone else.

The 200 mesh filter is what is recommended and they are relatively cheap.
The filters can be back flushed to clean them out also.
Here is a link to some filters you may be interested in.
Sadly they dont have one for chlorine.
I do suspect that the bodies would accept a chlorine filter if you looked around or took measurements.
Most of this stuff is standard sizes anyway.

Dont freak out the prices range from expensive to affordable. :lol:
[url]http://www.sprinklerwarehouse.com/Drip-Irrigation-Screen-Disc-Filters-s/1046.htm[/url]

Worth

One thing caught my attention with this.
You already have drip tape under your plastic mulch.
You can tie a better line to the drip tape and use the tape to pull the better line under the mulch.
I would like to add pumps can get complicated.
They will look the same but be different due to the configuration of the impeller.
They will have various psi and gpm ratings.
But nothing you cant get around with a little research.
I would suspect you would want something that would put out around 10 gpm at no more than 25 psi.
That would be a small pump.


In Seattle now waiting on yet another plane to get home.:roll:

Worth

I read a link last night from the University of California. They tested drip irrigation methods to see if they clogged with organic fertigation. They found that even with drip tape, organic ferts did not clog the emitters as suspected. They did flush out the lines with pure water after each injection, which might be the difference between it working and not working.

Kelp4less has several soluble ferts that I think would work fine in a EZ Flow, both certified organic and natural. I will need to plumb some valves in order to be able to bypass the injector and switch to straight water at the end of a cycle. I'm not sure I will be able to make that work on a timer, though.

Maybe I can get a truckload of wood chips to mulch the beds, so I can access the drip line more easily than if it were under plastic.

[QUOTE=Cole_Robbie;433475]I read a link last night from the University of California. They tested drip irrigation methods to see if they clogged with organic fertigation. They found that even with drip tape, organic ferts did not clog the emitters as suspected. They did flush out the lines with pure water after each injection, which might be the difference between it working and not working.

Kelp4less has several soluble ferts that I think would work fine in a EZ Flow, both certified organic and natural. I will need to plumb some valves in order to be able to bypass the injector and switch to straight water at the end of a cycle. I'm not sure I will be able to make that work on a timer, though.

Maybe I can get a truckload of wood chips to mulch the beds, so I can access the drip line more easily than if it were under plastic.[/QUOTE]


What kind of timer do you have?


Worth

I haven't bought one yet. I wanted to for next year so my watering would be more regular.

[QUOTE=Cole_Robbie;433477]I haven't bought one yet. I wanted to for next year so my watering would be more regular.[/QUOTE]

You can go two routes one that is cheap like the battery powered timers you can get at the big box stores or you can go the other way and get a real timer.
The cheap way will lead you down the path of spending more and more money with what you want to do.:lol:
Not all of the timers are the same either the programming is different on all of them as far as timing and options go.

I will be back in a bit and show you how it can be done with a drawing.

Worth

[ATTACH]45720[/ATTACH]

This one would work either with a timer or the battery operated ones.

You could get the two outlet battery operated timer and just connect the hoses up in the fashion of the drawing.
Set your time for the fertilizer and then right after the 2nd outlet would flush the system for however long you wanted.

Worth

Thanks. Honestly, I had to look up what a solenoid is. I need to learn such things.

It would look like this, right?
[url]http://www.chinazhanying.com/photo/original_d62ce9db0bd144ada8bdf1683ed6f836/bi-stable-brass-solenoid-valve.jpg[/url]

Are they always brass, or do they make pvc ones?

[QUOTE=Cole_Robbie;433488]Thanks. Honestly, I had to look up what a solenoid is. I need to learn such things.

It would look like this, right?
[URL]http://www.chinazhanying.com/photo/original_d62ce9db0bd144ada8bdf1683ed6f836/bi-stable-brass-solenoid-valve.jpg[/URL]

Are they always brass, or do they make pvc ones?[/QUOTE]

No that is the wrong one you need to get ones for irrigation.
Let me give a picture and a link.
[URL]http://www.sprinklerwarehouse.com/Sprinkler-System-Irrigation-Valves-s/36.htm[/URL]
[IMG]http://www.irrigationtutorials.com/reviews/valves/irritrol-2500tf.jpg[/IMG]

All of your Irrigation valves work off of 24VAC and if you look at the specs not all of them are the same.
You can get a few good valves at HD and Lowes but make sure you have a flow control on them.The flow control is the valve handle on top.
You can even get them threaded if you like or slip I got all of mine threaded.

thanks for the link

Your more than welcome.
Out of all of the research I have done I have found these valves to be the best fit for everything.
They would be the 2500 Series valves from Irritrol with flow control.
They will work from .025 GPM to 30 GPM.
Some valves will open at a low flow rate but wont close.
You dont want that for obvious reasons.
The reason for the flow control is two things you control the flow if you wish and the other in important.
If at full flow it wont close you can turn down the flow with this valve and it will close.

Worth
[url]http://www.sprinklerwarehouse.com/Irritrol-Sprinkler-Irrigation-Valve-p/2500tf.htm[/url]

Since the web site is huge I have will provid links to what you will need to help you set this up.
Filters.
[url]http://www.sprinklerwarehouse.com/Drip-Irrigation-Screen-Disc-Filters-s/1046.htm[/url]
Timers.
[url]http://www.sprinklerwarehouse.com/Sprinkler-Timers-Controllers-s/23.htm[/url]

The prices seem a little high at first but you have to think about the free time you will have doing other things.

Plus if thought out you can customize the watering to any need.

It really depends on what you want to do.
What ever you decide to do I will try to help you with it I'm not here to sell my ideas but to help with other peoples ideas.

Right now I can turn my water on from my laptop I am typing this from.:lol:


Worth

So a timer like this one?
[URL]http://www.sprinklerwarehouse.com/Toro-Battery-Operated-Controllers-s/9373.htm[/URL] (I'm looking at the 2-station one)

Each of the controllers goes to one of the solenoids in your diagram, right?

[QUOTE=Cole_Robbie;433508]So a timer like this one?
[URL]http://www.sprinklerwarehouse.com/Toro-Battery-Operated-Controllers-s/9373.htm[/URL] (I'm looking at the 2-station one)

Each of the controllers goes to one of the solenoids in your diagram, right?[/QUOTE]
Yes each station would go to a valve and there would be a master valve too.


I'm confused as to whether it comes withe the latching solenoids.:?
They are different than the regular ones.
The way these timers work and any other battery type is they toggle.
Meaning they get a short burst of electricity from the timer and a switch toggles to on or off.
You still have to have valves and run some amount of wire to make these things work.
I think they were intended for remote areas without electricity and they are costly.

I think a better option would be the other type hose end battery operated timer they have if you want to go battery operated.

Is there any reason not to use the 120 volt timers?

Worth

Here is one for a hose end timer.
[ATTACH]45722[/ATTACH]

The problem with this one is your limits on watering due to the program they all have.
It would work fine just for the fertilizer set up but you would need another timer for just watering if that is the way you are going.

In other words if you set up the EZ flow station 1 for lets say one hour then a flush station 2 for 10 minutes that would be all you have.
You couldn't set up station 2 for any more than 10 minutes even if you set it up to go off every day or every other day.
I have two of these things one 1 station and the other a 2 station.
One is on my counter.
You could add another one parallel to the two station timer and tie it in down line from the flush station 2.
What a contraption it would be.:lol:

Worth