Corn Quandry
 

I've always grown sweet corn in six single rows 3' apart. Last year I experimented with double rows; two rows 12" apart and 3' between pairs of rows. More corn in 8 rows in a shorter length of the garden. With just the 3' between pairs, there was a problem pulling enough soil to the outside of the plants and also to the middle of the pairs.

During the growing time there were several high wind storms that came through and laid the corn down. Either they blew down because they hadn't been adequately hilled and thus didn't have strong enough tillers or the winds were high enough that the corn would have blown down any way, like these young plants in the first pic. That has sometimes happened with single row corn adequately hilled.

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It's getting near corn planting time again. I was thinking maybe do the double rows again but with 4' between pairs. That would give me plenty of soil on each side to pull to the stalks. I had good pollination with the 3' between rows but would 4' apart mess with pollination? Hand pollinate to be sure? Gently smack the stalks occasionally with a stick to shake out pollen?

Then I thought about three triple rows, 3 rows each 12" apart and 4' between sets of three. :shock: Better pollination than double rows and even more corn in less space using three sets of three. But maybe a hassle hilling and also fertilizing that middle row.

Maybe I'm just getting greedy, wanting more corn in less space. But this year the corn is on the left side of the garden.

[IMG]https://i.imgur.com/ZNBrCHi.jpg[/IMG]

Some of that patch is somewhat shaded in the afternoon. Doing triple rows and starting them just below the last bed above the corn area would minimize the shade thing.

I'd be grateful for any input or general thoughts, positive or negative!

Corn usually stands itself back up. that said.. I wouldn't go to a triple set of rows and then a space. I think that would be a pain to pick.other than to cultivate and hill the soil I don't think there is a lot of option. We grow an acre of sweet corn and occasionally it does get blown sideways but rarely stays laying down. if it does than it is a mess to pick but there isn't much to do about it. I can't go through an acre of corn and hill it up after the fact.

I wouldn't plant 3 to a row either, that will be a pain to hip/sidedress.

I'm trying something different this year too. I'm hoping I can get away without spending too much time weeding and hipping the corn. I planted an 18'x 18' block with seeds 2.5-3" deep every 7 inches with rows 24" apart. Germination is close to 99.5%. After watching a few farmer videos I thought planting deeper would help hold the plant up in winds and maybe I won't have to hip so high or not at all. The closer planting will hopefully hold the weeds down to a minimum once the plants get 2-3' tall.

I tilled the area and applied 3 lbs of 10-10-10 and tilled that in then used a push plow to make a furrow and planted in that. I should only have to sidedress once at the V6 stage. I plan to loosen the soil between the rows and apply nitrogen down the middle and cover it up. Of course all that might change depending on how much rain we get.

Doing the math that's 18 dozen corn in an 18'x 18' area, I know I won't harvest that much with pressure from coons and squirrels but I should have enough to put up and try again for a fall crop.

How deep did you plant the seeds?
I see no reason to hill corn if planted deep enough as a matter of fact a small hill hoed up next to the row wont be much help keeping the corn upright in a wind storm.
Hoeing that hill up at the wrong time will do more harm than good by cutting roots that otherwise would help hold the corn up.
If you have exposed roots coming off the sides of the main stalk they are called prop roots.
A tiller is a stalk that grows next to the base of the main stalk it has nothing to do with helping keep the corn upright.

Sometimes even the best of planting and plans cant keep the corn from blowing over in small patches because there is no wind break as there would be for a big field of corn.

I never hill my corn either and they usually have lots of those prop roots.

I appreciate all of the input. I've been thinking about it on and off today and think I will just stick to the double rows. But it will be interesting to see how Rajun's spacing works out. I usually plant 2" deep but it's nice to know that even 3" works. Planting will happen Wednesday or Thursday.

When hand pollinating, just pull the pollen laden tassel out of the plant and work with that. It pops out easily.

I planted today and decided to do the four double rows and spaced the double rows 3.5' apart, not the 3 ' or 4' scenario. 90% chance of rain Friday which will water them in just fine.

How deep did you plant the seeds? Just wondering.

We have your storm/rain coming tomorrow so I side dressed today at the v5 stage. If it rains buckets I won't be able to work the soil so I jumped the gun.

After I finished I did a little research about corn root growth and I might've hurt the plants roots by trenching too close to the plants but they're all still standing happy after a few hours so hopefully the deep planting made up for my eagerness. I only trenched about 2" deep pushing the soil away from the plant and then came back and pushed the soil to the plant to cover the urea.

I used the antique push plow to make a tench on both sides of the plants about 4-6" from them and dropped 25 lbs of urea(46-0-0). The soil wasn't compacted so the push plow made this the easiest and fastest way to get it done.


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Rajun, hope you're ok. That's some rough weather that passed through.

I planted 2" deep. That's always worked well when I've been able to adequately hill the stalks. I used to just fertilize with 10-10-10 pre-plant and then like a neighbor used to do which is at knee high and at the first sign of a tassel.

Two years ago I did a lot of reading and switched up a bit. Kept the 10-10-10 pre-plant and then the first side dressing was at the 5 leaf stage with 2 oz ammonium sulfate per 18' row (I had read that corn likes a tad of sulphur) and added a drizzle of 5-10-15.

Then when the first tassels started pushing I side dressed with 15-0-15 with a drizzle of superphosphate. It was the first year I didn't see any sign of that maroon color low on the stalks indicating some kind of nutrient problem. And the corn did great.

This year I've switched from amm sulfate to nitrate. The nitrate was a lot less expensive.

This is a great pdf from N. Dakota Extension I found two years ago. It explains in detail every single leaf stage with photos too. I learned a lot from this.
[URL]https://www.ag.ndsu.edu/pubs/plantsci/crops/a1173.pdf[/URL]

Someone that lives down town has their game on when it comes to corn.
Every year they plant it in huge tubs in the driveway.
Beautiful plants and ears.
I live in a small town you can walk from one end of down town to the other in about 10 minutes or so.:)
Sadly urban sprawl is taking over though.

The storm wasn't bad, windy with gusts to 25+ and 2.3" of rain. I see it's moving to the East coast today.

I just checked on the garden and even those small corn plants are leaning from the wind. I guess it's time to string up the tomatoes, they're also laying down from the wind.

I read that link you posted a few days ago. That's where I got the info about hurting the roots by trenching so close to the plants. I didn't think a plant that small at V6 has roots 18" deep and 24" in radius. I didn't see roots when I side dressed so hopefully they're deeper then a few inches of the surface. Here's another link about root pruning while sidedressing. [url]https://www.ipni.net/ipniweb/pnt.nsf/5a4b8be72a35cd46852568d9001a18da/89953f4ef979f17d852572df0064aa0c!OpenDocument[/url]

Every time I see this thread's title [B]Corn Quandry[/B] I see it as Coin Laundry or Corn Laundry or Coin Quandry :lol:

Of course, there's nothing funny about high winds laying down your crop.

Some varieties are simply stockier than others. I've done Hawaiian #9 (silver). :?:



This variety has thin stalks and grows to 11 1/2 feet (measured to tip of tassel). The only way I've managed to keep it upright is with a multi-level Florida weave. I plant in 4 foot squares, 4 plants 1 foot apart in a row, 4 rows 1 foot apart, 16 plants total per square, a 10-11 foot pole in each corner of the square.

I dodged another storm yesterday for the most part except some rain. Hopefully it dries up in the next few days so I can weed the garden, I hate those light drizzles every other day keeping the soil too wet to work.

Here's 9 days growth after sidedressing, they seem happy!
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So pretty, Rajun! Happy indeed. :yes:

I spied the first few seeds up yesterday. I'll have to soak the ground again as it's dry here. The rain we were supposed to get today won't happen. The front is passing through dry.

And just like that, something started the war!!!x---
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What a difference in size a few weeks make. You can see the smaller plants on the right where the ground is lower and holds water when it rains hard, I'm guessing the water washed away the nitrogen.




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Some are starting to tassle:D
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Wow, your corn is going gangbusters! It's amazing how you look at it one day and before you know it, it's already knee high once it kicks in! Suckin' up that nitrogen! :lol:

Hopefully the silks are right behind.



I once had tassles ready to do their thing, but no ears showing anywhere. So, I gathered the pollen, put it in the freezer, and a month later I took it out and hand pollinated the silks.

What is your experience with the double row plantings?

I am considering double rows 12in apart and 2 foot space before the next double row starts. Only have enough space to do 2 double rows..... ie 4 rows total.

So far the corn is looking good. No down-side I can see yet to the double row method. After the first side dressing, pulling some soil over the shallow fertilizer furrow kind of created a valley between each double row. Once I couldn't water overhead because the adjacent potato row had to dry out a bit, I hand watered. It turned out that the valley held water nicely, allowing it to slowly sink in. An unexpected plus.

[IMG]https://i.imgur.com/RiEoi9c.jpg[/IMG]

I think I'll go back to 3' spacing between the double rows next year. 4' isn't necessary. Live and learn.

Next year I may go to one big growout. The way I have been doing it is to succession plant, three plantings staggered by a couple or three weeks. It is beginning to wear on me...maybe one big crop and then freezing would be better. I do get corn earlier than any local for sale, but it is a lot of work. Last year, only the 2nd set pollinated decently, and that was by hand.

Reading this, I am envious of Rajun's block of 18 doz at once, 7"/2 ft rows. I have two sets in and I should have planted again last week. I went with double rows this year, two parallel double rows for each set, 9"spacing with about 18" in the double and then about 3 ft between the doubles. So that takes 6 rows of garden space. All three sets are in the same patch.

The last time I put three sets of corn at the same spot, the corn came up nice, pollinated almost perfectly, but as I finished picking the first set (8-10 per day for dinner) and began picking the second, squirrels started destroying all the remaining cobs, ripe or not. I had to pick all of set 2 to salvage, and 3 never got a chance to ripen at all. I'd estimate I lost 50% of the potential that year. I suppose that will happen again this year if I don't find a way to protect it.

BTW that was triple rows that came in so well, but I never sidedressed. Just 10-10-10 and raised beds with tons of compost. This year with the double rows I intended to side dress as well, but I don' know if I'll get to it.

Now I have to measure how much space I am using for these 6 double rows and calculate how many possible in one big block of 7"/24".

Looking good GoDawgs!!! Hang in there and before you know it you'll have some of these.
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Blanched, chilled and resting in the fridge for supper!!! I had to sample a few of raw and cooked, both were DEElicious!!! Is there anything better than fresh off the stalk sweet corn?
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I'm not sure if it's the spacing or the crazy, rainy, cloudy weather but these should be bigger. We had rain most of spring and then 2 weeks ago the rain stopped, the sun came out and it's been summertime heat since. Maybe it's a combination of both.:hm?:

I also noticed the shorter corn had bigger worms in them compared to a few with small worms in the bigger corn.

I know these were just a few early ones but it's been 63 days since I dropped the seeds and 22 days since I noticed tassles on some stalks.

These were just the early ones that were ripe so maybe the others will grow bigger.

Those are some gorgeous ears, Rajun! Ones to be proud of. :love:
Gotta ask... what variety are you growing? I went back to the beginning of this thread and I didn't see you mention it. I'm just gonna guess that it was all those cloudy days that maybe kept the ears shorter? Corn sure does love the sun.

I keep putting the water to mine. It's at Day 40 from seeding right now.

I'm growing Peaches-n-Cream and might drop another few rows soon just to see if they survive the bug pressure.

I've never had much success with a second crop. Between bugs and the heat, I guess it's not to be. Plus I could use a break in garden work. 8-)

GoDawgs did you pick any yet?
Corn Quandry is a good title. Every year. It just takes up so much room in a garden but I want as much as I can get because none of it goes to waste.

My first two double rows are about at half silk. The tassels tops are about my eye level, call it 5-1/2 ft tall. Looks like two cobs forming on each. I am growing "Incredible" this year. Seems to me it has been excellent weather for my setup of raised double rows. We have had heavy rains, but then it clears up the next day instead of lingering high humidity and wetness. Lots of fields here have flooded areas each week. It has been nice not having to water.

This next month of course will make or break it but to me it looks good at this point. There was no way I could see to side dress it the way I have it set up, but I did look into it this year. I was about ready to plant butternut starts in the walking paths, but now I'm thinking maybe I just put them in the doubles of the set that is at half silk already. I was worried about the butternut stealing too much nutrition too soon, but they are just a week old and if those rows are done in 4 weeks...? Last year I planted two hungry 5 week old cantaloupe in one end of a corn block while the corn was still very young. That entire end of the block didn't stay a deep green and never sized up, and was practically a total loss.

I'll take a picture tonight and see what you guys think.

JR, I'm glad you mentioned it! I must be slipping because I picked the first four ears yesterday, didn't take a pic and didn't mention it! :lol:

Here's what the Silver Queen looked like eight days ago:

[IMG]https://i.imgur.com/N6TfmC1.jpg[/IMG]

We ate them with lunch yesterday and the kernels need to size up just a bit more but the pollination was perfect and they were right tasty! Maybe another five days. With Silver Queen those silks have to be completely dark when ready and most of the ears are still showing a tinge of gold right where they emerge from the ear.

I side dressed down each side of the double row at the 5 leaf stage and again when tassels started showing.

I've also got Japanese Hulless Popcorn growing (first time for popcorn) in a bed near the Silver Queen. Got the planting timing right as the first tassels are just starting to peek out and the Queen is done pollinating. This pic was 8 days ago too and they're about a foot taller now:

[IMG]https://i.imgur.com/JBa9cb3.jpg[/IMG]

Again, I had some delayed germination here and there so there are plants of different sizes. That's probably going to cause some pollination issues just like it did with the Spring Treat in a bed. This has taught me that when planting in a bed, overseed. Hadn't had that problem before but overseed I will!

I certainly ate a lot of silver queen growing up. I've been growing a white supersweet the last three years but this year it will be yellow...I hope I like it. Nobody else here seems to have a color pref. I have always liked white corn better. I see yellow corn and I think it's from the grocery store, from a can, or for feed. Hopefully this Incredible changes my mind.

Upon closer inspection I would estimate only 1/4 have silk showing on that first set. The top cobs are forming 6 or 7 leaves down. I never thought to look at that before. Garlic has me counting leaves.

My first set, I planted every 5" intending to thin if needed. I planted under clear plastic and slit it when some sprouted. I may have slit too early. I had about 75% timely germination, but a few feet with blanks, so I swapped some from thick to thin. Then I put down the thin black bio mulch, punching holes for each sprout as I unrolled it. That was a chore but I'm so glad I did...it does such a great job. Then ag19 hoops over top. I did end up thinning it a bit, but it wasn't until I took the agribon off. The next two sets I planted 9" spacing in the row and double seeded through the heavy woven mulch that you burn holes through with a torch. I still I had a few misses double seeding, less than 5%, but most had two and I thinned to one each. A few fell over with the extra hole space and heavy winds but seem to have recovered. I took the agribon off the third set today. They were pushing the hoops, so about knee high.

Around here all the farm girls say "knee high by the 4th of July" for corn, meaning that everything is going well. My first set was knee high by mid-May when I put out tomatoes.

With the plastic mulch, I'm not sure how I'd side dress. There should be plenty of nutrition since the entire beds are finished compost. It is the nice dark stuff you can see next to the corn where I planted sweet potatoes (Georgia something) a couple weeks back.

This is the first year I did all direct seed for corn, rather than soil block transplants. I think what I want to try next year is a first round of 2-3 week old soil blocks into the ground on the same day as I put the second set into the ground as seed. First, we'll have to see if the 2nd and 3rd sets get hammered by squirrels when the first becomes fully ripe and gives off sweet scent. If that happens again...I don't see a way other than one big block. I'm still looking at ideas to prevent that. I'd love to sit there with a .22 and end those problems in one morning but that would be frowned upon by all the people that buy their corn for $6 a dozen.

Direct overseeding two to a hole worked pretty well. As long as you buy a big enough bag of seed and can go through it before it gets too big, seems like the way to go rather than changing up the spacing. I never have anywhere near perfect germination outdoors.



Edited to add: I planted 2"+ deep. The rows were made and smacked down firm with shovel, then I took two 5/16" bolts. One set at 2" with a nut that a made the hole 2" deep, then dropped in the seed, and a second bolt with nut on the end to ram them down. It went pretty quickly. They have stood up very well to high winds.