Kumato
 

Yes I ate them. Yes they are quite good. Yes I saved seeds. Yes I will plant them. And yes I will eat them too.

So, what do you reckon this variety is really?

It is a [URL="http://www.kumato.com/en/Pages/AllRightsReserved.aspx"]F1 hybrid called Kumato, from Syngenta[/URL].

If you save seed you will see quite a bit of segregation for taste and color.

I like it too.
Last year I planted F2 seeds and saves seeds and I am growing F3.
The F2 produced exact the same fruits That I buy from Trader Joes.

Gardeneer

[B]About Growth Habit:[/B]
[B]Indet: RL
Height : ~ 4-5ft.
DTM: mid to late season. [/B]
I planted it in 5 gallon container last year. It was not a vigorous plant at all. Only forked once.
Not very productive but then it was worth growing in 5gl container. Not much maintenance required.
So far my plant this year is better than last year.

Kumato was bred in Spain and Ilex in Spain sent me Negro de Olmeda which he said was a sister to Kumato.

There are many links here at Tville

It was initially introduced to the US under another name by Dulcea, as Rosso Bruno

[url]http://www.tomatoville.com/showthread.php?[/url]

wiki

[url]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kumatot=34947&highlight=Kumato[/url]


When Syngenta got a hold of it their first description of it was hilarious,as in from The Galapagos islands,somehow connected to turtles,with sexual overtones of why eating Kumatos would be good for you.I think Terry at Secret Seed Cartel may still have that info,I did as well but too hard to find in my faves.

I know Ilex very well, and he wouldn't be dealing with F1 hybrids,so when he sent me the sister to Kumato, Negro de Olmeda, it implies,at least to me,that perhaps Kumato and the former one were initially bred and then who knows what happened whe Snyngenta got a hold of it.

Many have tried to make selections from the F1,with varying results

[url]https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&site=imghp&tbm=isch&source=hp&biw=1402&bih=778&q=Kumato+wikipedia&oq=Kumato+wikipedia&gs_l=img.12..0i5i30j0i24.3635.26426.0.30794.18.17.1.0.0.0.125.1996.0j17.17.0....0...1ac.1.64.img..0.17.1871.g3t8TMsVUsA[/url]

Ok,I just had to see if I could find where Kumato was said to be from the Galapagos IS, and I did. Terry's blog about that as well as several others talk about the sexual powers of Kumato that Syngenta alluded to

[url]https://www.google.com/search?q=Kumato+galapagos+islands&hl=en&biw=1402&bih=778&site=imghp&source=lnms&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi598HEpKfMAhUFWD4KHRS-B24Q_AUIBigA&dpr=1[/url]


Happy reading. ;)

Carolyn

Thanks Carolyn. You are a living encyclopedia of tomato knowledge. I have your book, btw. Love it, but such a fraction of your knowledge.

Anyway, here goes the hopeless experimenter in me. I never met a tomato, hybrid or not that I didn't want to save seeds from and grown.

I saved seed from them as well. Haven't grown them out yet. Should be interesting :)

i tried the same experiment with the mini kumatos I purchased at the grocery store. I thought they tasted pretty good, but when I grew them out next to Black cherry they weren't nexrly as tasty. What taste fairly good for a winter home grown deprived person just doesn't cut it when you have the real thing.

I grew one out last year and not really worth it. It was Thanksgiving 2014 when my local market had them on sale in an enormous tower at 3lbs for 5dollars. Usual price was 1lb for 5dollars. (expensive!). They had good color and texture and a bit tangy-sweet. A winter treat but still needed that splash of white balsamic trick for a winter tom to be even close to good eating.

This year the packaging changed a couple times and they no longer call them 'Kumato'. I think the 2014 batch were grown in Canada. This year grown in Mexico and not nearly as good and were mealy. Just tried them once.

I just use my frozen garden slices and make a salsa in the winter months.

Late season, thick walled, flavorless space holder...

I've seen a patent for Kumato tomatoes. So, I wouldn't be surprised if they did something weird with them. I'm not talking about PVP or something like that. I mean an actual patent. That seems to imply they might be GMO or something similar, since patents aren't supposed to be granted for traditionally bred varieties.

[QUOTE=shule1;555387]I've seen a patent for Kumato tomatoes. So, I wouldn't be surprised if they did something weird with them. I'm not talking about PVP or something like that. I mean an actual patent. That seems to imply they might be GMO or something similar, since patents aren't supposed to be granted for traditionally bred varieties.[/QUOTE]

Yes,in my above post I linked to Kumato at Wiki,but when I just looked at it it had changed,so I fetched it again

[url]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kumato[/url]

Where again it states it was patented.

I know Ilex very well and when he said that Olmeda was the sister to Kumato, both being OP,I'm having problems seeing anything GMO about it,but I can ask him again if you want me to.

There are many varieties that are patentended that have nothing to do with GMO's they patentent them to indicate ownership.

I also agree that patenets are not usually given to traditionally bred varieties, OR even original non bred varieties,but I ask if you are aware of the situation with Goose Creek tomato, as an excellent example of making up claims about a variety to indeed be granted a patent.

Jimmy Williams did that and his application for a patent was denied.

Carolyn

There are no GMO tomatoes currently on the market.

[QUOTE=shule1;555387]I've seen a patent for Kumato tomatoes. So, I wouldn't be surprised if they did something weird with them. I'm not talking about PVP or something like that. I mean an actual patent. That seems to imply they might be GMO or something similar, since patents aren't supposed to be granted for traditionally bred varieties.[/QUOTE]

Here is a picture that shows a Kumato that I harvested last year.

It came true 100%, just like the tomato that I took seed from.
This year I will try to cross it with one of dark tomatoes.

Gardeneer

@Fred and Carolyn

I've also heard that there are no GE tomatoes on the market, currently (a year or so ago), but life changes fast and they have a habit of telling us about these things years after we've already been eating them (with some notable exceptions wherein they have traits that appeal to consumers rather than just to commercial growers); also, new GE tomatoes are said to exist, whether or not they're on the market, yet, so I've heard. That could be false, but probably easy to verify. When they are released they'll most likely be in grocery store produce, or products, though (not seed and plant catalogs). Anyway, that's why I said, 'or something', too. A lot of genetic manipulation can occur without genetic engineering (I'm not talking about via conventional breeding either, although conventional breeding is potentially *part* of the process). I don't really think Kumato is a GMO. It just looked like a possibility is all.

I'm interested to know why the Kumato tomato is patented more than I'm interested in knowing if it's genetically engineered, but an answer to the first should answer the last. There's very little legal ability to patent a tomato if it's not genetically engineered, though, as far as I know (tell me if I'm wrong), but I imagine exceptions may exist. I'm not talking about plant breeders rights when I say patents. However, companies don't always go for legal patents when they go for patents, and the patents are sometimes revoked later on when they're discovered to be illegal. But the question is, is it legal to infringe on an illegal patent that has not yet and may not ever be revoked? I mean, even if you go to court and prove that it's illegal, and they revoke it, will you still be prosecuted if you infringed? I'm guessing that's for the court to decide as far as they're concerned.

Anyway, you don't have to answer any of those questions I asked. I don't really want to get into an involved discussion. I'm just kind of obsessive, and responding with more information and thoughts than is probably common for conversion.

[QUOTE=shule1;555518]@Fred and Carolyn

I've also heard that there are no GE tomatoes on the market, currently (a year or so ago), but life changes fast and they have a habit of telling us about these things years after we've already been eating them (with some notable exceptions wherein they have traits that appeal to consumers rather than just to commercial growers); also, new GE tomatoes are said to exist, whether or not they're on the market, yet, so I've heard. That could be false, but probably easy to verify. When they are released they'll most likely be in grocery store produce, or products, though (not seed and plant catalogs). Anyway, that's why I said, 'or something', too. A lot of genetic manipulation can occur without genetic engineering (I'm not talking about via conventional breeding either, although conventional breeding is potentially *part* of the process). I don't really think Kumato is a GMO. It just looked like a possibility is all.

I'm interested to know why the Kumato tomato is patented more than I'm interested in knowing if it's genetically engineered, but an answer to the first should answer the last. There's very little legal ability to patent a tomato if it's not genetically engineered, though, as far as I know (tell me if I'm wrong), but I imagine exceptions may exist. I'm not talking about plant breeders rights when I say patents. However, companies don't always go for legal patents when they go for patents, and the patents are sometimes revoked later on when they're discovered to be illegal. But the question is, is it legal to infringe on an illegal patent that has not yet and may not ever be revoked? I mean, even if you go to court and prove that it's illegal, and they revoke it, will you still be prosecuted if you infringed? I'm guessing that's for the court to decide as far as they're concerned.

Anyway, you don't have to answer any of those questions I asked. I don't really want to get into an involved discussion. I'm just kind of obsessive, and responding with more information and thoughts than is probably common for conversion.[/QUOTE]


If you want to know why the tomato is patented, read the patent. It's linked from the Wiki page or here:

[url]https://www.google.com/patents/US7612261?dq=United+States+Patent+7612261&hl=en&sa=X&ei=G5IHVPr3A4rpoASS8YKoBQ&ved=0CB0Q6AEwAA[/url]