Tomatoville® Gardening Forums

Tomatoville® Gardening Forums (http://www.tomatoville.com/index.php)
-   The Workbench: BIY™ (http://www.tomatoville.com/forumdisplay.php?f=148)
-   -   Raybo's Removable, Self-supporting, Collapsible, Tall Cage for the EarthTainer (pics) (http://www.tomatoville.com/showthread.php?t=16256)

Rockporter March 29, 2012 02:50 PM

A Third way to attach Pea Fence
 
12 Attachment(s)
Raybo and BDank, I wanted to show you my take on your Pea Fence design I am using on my Earth Box. I don't have anywhere to sink the Rebar into the ground since my containers are on concrete. I am using Zip Ties to attach the cage to my Earth Box and a concrete brick on the opposite wind side to keep it from toppling in the wind. I have used this design for 2 seasons and am starting my third one.

Photos below with instructions.

You will start with 1 EB, 2 Gurney's Pea Fences and your Wire Rope Clips following Raybos Design to put them together. You will need your Zip Ties and a Wire Cutting Tool. You will not bend the cage at all, just put it together(see photos 10 and 11 for reference).

Photo 1
Zip Ties tied together to make a ring, use as many as it takes to wrap tightly against the top of EB and add 12 zip ties in a small loop to the ring, I will explain further down the line.

Photo 2
Slip the zip tie ring under the EB being careful not to topple it or spill out your precious rain water as I did.

Photo 3
Place the cage onto the EB and attach a zip tie to one of the extra 12 zip tie loops you added to the zip tie ring and loop this third zip tie to the cage(2 per short side and 4 per long side) making sure you don't fully tighten them until you have all attached and you can tighten them evenly around the EB. The short end of the EB will have the cage on top of it and the long end on each side will have the cage hanging over a small amount.

Photo 4, 5 and 6
Zip Tie is cinched tightly around the cage and attached to the small looped zip tie you attached to the large ring of zip ties.

Photo 7 and 8
Shows all zip ties evenly cinched around the EB with all the zip ties trimmed.

Photo 9
Completed Cage attached to EB with zip ties.

Photo 10, 11 and 12
Two Gurney Pea Fences attached together with Wire Rope Clips according to Raybo's Design.
Cage Rod Overlapping(I did this to keep from being injured by the rods when reaching into the cage, you could make the cage higher if you need to, I only plant indeterminates so don't need the extra 3 inches or so.
Tools needed for assembly of Zip Tie Ring.



*******NOTE:********

At the end of the season, cut only the third zip tie off to remove the cage for easy redo of the EB planting mix and your plantings. Then use just twelve new zip ties to reattach the cage to the EB. I am on my third planting with this design.

rnewste March 29, 2012 03:00 PM

Very nice construction.:yes:

As the plants reach near the top, there will be a tendency in the wind for the cage to act like a sail, and tip over. Since you are on a concrete pad, I would make some form of an "L" bracket on each side of your EarthBox that would sit outboard of the Box, then bolt it to the cage.

Think like outriggers on a canoe. This will give you some stability on the concrete pad when windy. Keep us posted with pictures during the Season.

Raybo:)

Rockporter March 29, 2012 03:19 PM

Thanks Raybo, I appreciate your original post and then BDanks subsequent one using the design on an EB. I do have concrete cinder blocks that I use to keep the box from tipping over and haven't had a problem yet. I do like your idea for supporting the EB(cage) with your "L" bracket idea. I will let you know if I do implement this design.

rnewste March 29, 2012 04:51 PM

The kind of "L" bracket I am thinking about is the type used for shelving. I would look for the longest ones available (18 inches minimum), then use the wire rope clips in 2 places to attach it to the cage. In fact, I would probably use a pair of brackets on each long side of the EB spaced apart near each corner, which would give you even greater stability in the wind.

Raybo;)

EDIT: I just noticed in picture #9 that you have the casters on. I would definitely remove them, as they make it easier for the EB to tip with your cage loaded with fruit. You want as stable a base as possible.

Rockporter March 29, 2012 05:36 PM

[QUOTE=rnewste;264645]The kind of "L" bracket I am thinking about is the type used for shelving. I would look for the longest ones available (18 inches minimum), then use the wire rope clips in 2 places to attach it to the cage. In fact, I would probably use a pair of brackets on each long side of the EB spaced apart near each corner, which would give you even greater stability in the wind.

Raybo;)

EDIT: I just noticed in picture #9 that you have the casters on. I would definitely remove them, as they make it easier for the EB to tip with your cage loaded with fruit. You want as stable a base as possible.[/QUOTE]

I like your "L" bracket idea.

The wheels have to stay on the box because when we get a real cold front and high winds I have to move said box into the screen area and close it up. If you notice in the pic I have 4 SWP made of 5 gallon buckets and those are on wheeled plant holders too. I can't lift the buckets so the wheels make it easier to move them into the screen closure much easier. I haven't had a problem yet of them being knocked over so I think I will be ok. I am not far(1/2 mile or so) from the intercoastal waterway and we get lots of high wind gusts here, but those "Northers" really beat things up real good.

elight April 1, 2012 12:06 PM

Hi Ray,

I just completed the construction of my first EarthTainer yesterday without a hitch. The next step is the removable cage. I already ordered and received the Burpee's pea fences, and am just waiting to collect the other needed supplies. I wanted to let you know two things that I have discovered:

1. The "wire rope clips" at Lowe's have apparently gone up in price. The EarthTainer guide suggests that they cost $0.45, but they are actually $0.88 (at least by me). This means that if you are building more than ONE cage systems, it makes sense to order the box of 100.

2. I am having trouble locating a 1/4" stainless steel tube locally. I did find that Lowe's carries a 3/16" aluminum tube for around $2.50. By my measurements, this would be a very close fit... it may work, may not. Before I go and order the 1/4" tube online, have you by any chance tried with a 3/16" tube?

Thanks!

rnewste April 1, 2012 01:23 PM

elight,

Congrats on the EarthTainer build!!:yes:

Were there any part of the instruction that were confusing or unclear? I always want to improve the clarity of the Guide.

Regarding the bending tube, neither Lowes nor Home Depot carry this tube. You have to go to a full service Hardware store or Welding Supply store. I found it more convenient to order it on Ebay at the link I have in the Guide if you don't have a full service Hardware store locally.

Raybo:D

elight April 1, 2012 03:41 PM

Ray - I will send you a PM sometime this week with a few parts that I think might need some clarification (although ultimately I was able to get through the build without any trouble, really).

I will bite the bullet and order the tube online, as well as the wire rope clips. Although it would be a few dollars cheaper to pick up the $0.88 ones at Lowe's, I figure I'm going to build plenty more of these in future years.

bdank April 17, 2012 07:22 PM

[QUOTE=Rockporter;264617]Raybo and BDank, I wanted to show you my take on your Pea Fence design I am using on my Earth Box. [/QUOTE]

Rockporter, I love your idea. This is so much cheaper than using the staking system clamps. You might want to post this idea to my thread about these cages on the [URL="http://forum.earthbox.com/index.php?topic=7378.0"]earthbox forum.[/URL]

Rockporter April 17, 2012 09:57 PM

Hi BDank, I am finding that the cage parts that a sticking up are kind of dangerous though so I think I am going to try to get my husband to bend those thingsaround something to make them less dangerous. I was bending over next to the EB today and scratched my face on one of them. I never got close enough before I think but I could see somebody taking out their eye on that part. Safety fast, ya know?

bdank April 18, 2012 03:49 PM

[QUOTE=Rockporter;269085]Hi BDank, I am finding that the cage parts that a sticking up are kind of dangerous though so I think I am going to try to get my husband to bend those thingsaround something to make them less dangerous. I was bending over next to the EB today and scratched my face on one of them. I never got close enough before I think but I could see somebody taking out their eye on that part. Safety fast, ya know?[/QUOTE]

Yes, you can get scratched on those. I have thought of putting some kind of cap on the end but haven't found any that fit yet.

I posted a link to your photos here over on the earthbox forum.

Rockporter April 18, 2012 03:57 PM

[QUOTE=bdank;269227]Yes, you can get scratched on those. I have thought of putting some kind of cap on the end but haven't found any that fit yet.

I posted a link to your photos here over on the earthbox forum.[/QUOTE]

Thanks BDank. ;)

baileyj June 11, 2012 09:04 AM

This past weekend I attached my 3 new PeaFence trellises to my EBs...
I used 4--24 inch zipties for the band around the box--they are very thick and I hope will last longer ! I used 8 inch zips for the loops and tie-downs.

Just a word to the wise....the problem I had with the first box was not evenly tightening the 4 zipties, so when I was 99% done and tightening the cage down, one of the 4 unzipped:panic:

Emergency resolved by adding another tie, but it took a good bit of patience to finish !

Box #2 and #3 went very smoothly after learning my lesson.

I am hoping to compare the ziptie method to the EB clamp method with 2 boxes next to each other...

I hope the ziptie method wins !
Judi

Rockporter June 11, 2012 12:26 PM

I'm glad it worked out for you baileyj.

I haven't had any problems with mine hanging on and the setup has never leaned one way or the other, it is really sturdy. I think I might go the route of getting some of that sticky dip stuff for all my sharp points. I would like to know the results of your test between the EB clamps and the zip ties though.

I secure my EB upright by using cinder blocks, one on each side.

I just received 7 more EB's the other day and ordered all the pea fences and rope clips for them. I am switching everything over to EB's the next growing season. I won't have any other kind of planter around here because there isn't space for more than the eight EB's I will have. He he.

bdank June 11, 2012 01:18 PM

That's great, Judi. I'd love to see some photos.

Rockporter July 21, 2012 08:47 AM

My zip tie method is working out very well, I have two EB's with the cage connected and am not having any problems at all. I think if someone is having problems with the cage not being tight enough it is because they have not tightened it up properly. Mine are tight as tight could be.

Rockporter July 21, 2012 08:52 AM

How is your experiment doing?
 
[QUOTE=baileyj;282021]

I am hoping to compare the ziptie method to the EB clamp method with 2 boxes next to each other...

I hope the ziptie method wins !
Judi[/QUOTE]


Have the zipties won?

I had two yellow pear tomatoes that were supposed to be determinate but they were red cherry tomatoes and were extremely large. Not determinate but the zip tie method works fantastic and I even had two Basil plants in the box also. I have not had one problem with the cage staying on.

baileyj July 23, 2012 12:03 PM

I added 4 more cages with the zip ties this past weekend !! The challenge was I had tomatoes in various stages of growing so putting the cages over them and securing was tough....no one is ever in sight when you need that third hand...my dog is no help during times like this !

But I was successful...I now have 8 cages up, 7 with zip ties and 1 with EB clamps. The EB clamps work great, but so do the ties. With the cost ...I am gong with zip ties.

We went through that horrible "Hurricaine" or whatever term they made up to call it about 3 weeks ago....80 mile an hour winds !! And all cages that were Zip tied did great !

I had some issues with my PVC trellis, but that was due to poorly tying the tomatos to the trellis, then wind/rain.

I am headed to more pea fence/zip ties for next year. I have 8 up now and 4 more could go up, but the tomatoes are too large to add the cages....

When I figure out how to post pictures, I will....

Also never got to add the plastidip to the edges of the cages---I do have a few battle scars but...I am being more careful each week to not bump into them...

JB

Rockporter July 23, 2012 01:23 PM

This sounds great Bailey, I also now have a total of 8 EB's and am moving into a house with a huge backyard so I will be able to spread out some. I already bought the pea fences for the cages and the wire rope clips. I am ready, he he. Where do you get the plastidip stuff? I could sure use some of it.

baileyj August 18, 2012 08:58 AM

Rockporter,
Sorry I was away..The Plasitdip I found was at Lowes. I really need to get it on the edges before next year.

Update on my zip-ties versus clamps---about 10 days ago we had more wind and rain. My tomatoes are in 3 rows of 4 and are too close together so I will start there...
After the storm I had 3 boxes tipped over, the middle row box knocked into the 3rd row box and tipped it. Also another box (in row 1) tipped due to the cage moving--it had been tight but somehow is no longer seated on the box correctly. It is impossible to reseat at this point with the tomatoes so tall and prolific. No effect on the clamped box, but I only have 1 in row 3.

I have never had a wind problem on this side of the house so I did not put cinderblocks or EMT in to keep the boxes from tipping and was totally surprised. That will teach me...I should have been prepared !

I also find I have moles that have tunneled under and made the ground soft on the third row side, so the edge is no longer totally flat, making it softer thus more prone to tip, I guess.
The tomatos in those tipped boxes survived fine, better that I did. They were about 8 foot tall. I turned the boxes slightly and put heavy 5 gallon buckets between so they cannot tip anymore.

Next year I will put the rows much further apart and plan on a wind plan once the tomatoes get so tall. I still vote for the ties, one EB forum poster reported the clamps broke when their box was tipped over so there are no guarrentees the clamps would have held up any better that the ties in my yard.

I will try the zipties agan but on the EB forum Cushman posted an idea of placing 2 3-foot long 1inch EMT into the ground, attaching the cages to 3/4 EMT with clamps. Then sliding the 3/4 into the 1 inch EMT. The cages would not be attached to the box at all but over the box. I wil try that next year, at least on a few. This sounds like a better idea to avoid "sail" problem of the cage in the wind when the plants are so tall....
Good luck...

Rockporter August 18, 2012 02:12 PM

[QUOTE=baileyj;299237]Rockporter,
Sorry I was away..The Plasitdip I found was at Lowes. I really need to get it on the edges before next year.

Update on my zip-ties versus clamps---about 10 days ago we had more wind and rain. My tomatoes are in 3 rows of 4 and are too close together so I will start there...
After the storm I had 3 boxes tipped over, the middle row box knocked into the 3rd row box and tipped it. Also another box (in row 1) tipped due to the cage moving--it had been tight but somehow is no longer seated on the box correctly. It is impossible to reseat at this point with the tomatoes so tall and prolific. No effect on the clamped box, but I only have 1 in row 3.

I have never had a wind problem on this side of the house so I did not put cinderblocks or EMT in to keep the boxes from tipping and was totally surprised. That will teach me...I should have been prepared !

I also find I have moles that have tunneled under and made the ground soft on the third row side, so the edge is no longer totally flat, making it softer thus more prone to tip, I guess.
The tomatos in those tipped boxes survived fine, better that I did. They were about 8 foot tall. I turned the boxes slightly and put heavy 5 gallon buckets between so they cannot tip anymore.

Next year I will put the rows much further apart and plan on a wind plan once the tomatoes get so tall. I still vote for the ties, one EB forum poster reported the clamps broke when their box was tipped over so there are no guarrentees the clamps would have held up any better that the ties in my yard.

I will try the zipties agan but on the EB forum Cushman posted an idea of placing 2 3-foot long 1inch EMT into the ground, attaching the cages to 3/4 EMT with clamps. Then sliding the 3/4 into the 1 inch EMT. The cages would not be attached to the box at all but over the box. I wil try that next year, at least on a few. This sounds like a better idea to avoid "sail" problem of the cage in the wind when the plants are so tall....
Good luck...[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the update Bailey

I will check out Lowe's here nearby me for the plastidip.

Sorry to hear about your wind problems, is there no way to move the cage back into position on the EB? Maybe lift a little and then push sideways? I don't know, I am just thinking because I haven't had this problem and I am not sure how to reseat a cage on an EB.

On Cushmans plan it sounds good and I might give that a try myself. I have moved to the house and need to figure out what I am going to do garden placement wise and how I will secure everything. I don't know, I might just use the huge concrete patio and place all the EB's on the outside edges allowing us some privacy from the neighbors. The cinder blocks work well and are easily moved to a different place if needed. Hmm, need to think hard on this one.

Good luck with your next design, I am sure you will find what works for you. ;)

baileyj August 18, 2012 04:10 PM

Rockporter,
I just came in from about 2 hours of reseating the cages on 4 of my boxes. I think the problem I have is they are too close together, the plants are at least 8-10 foot high and bending over the top, and the space I use is no longer as flat as it was....

I was able to reseat the cages but it was tough. I am not sure they will stay but I did the best I could and they are no longer leaning over.

I will definitely try the EMT idea next year, but I think EMT is pretty heavy in tall lenghts so I am a bit worried about that. I have all winter to ponder and replan...

Somehow in the Spring I always seem to plant them close together to try to squeeze in another box...I need to stop that..Big note to self !!

thanks,
JB

Rockporter August 18, 2012 11:30 PM

Good luck Bailey, I am glad to hear you got some cages reseated.

Rockporter October 4, 2012 12:20 AM

[QUOTE=baileyj;299237]Rockporter,
The Plasitdip I found was at Lowes. I really need to get it on the edges before next year.[/QUOTE]


Hi Bailey, I got the plastidip done on all of my cages, I used a little white K-cup from my coffee machine and a craft stick to move the plastidip from the big container to the smaller one. It was the perfect size and I was able to do quite a few tips before I had to refill. I sealed the hole in the bottom of the K-cup with a piece of tape on the inside of the cup to keep the plastidip from coming out of the cup.

This was much better than my first try at just dipping right into the big container of plastidip. I knew that wasn't going to work because the dip was too low in the container and I couldn't get the points to reach into it deep enough.

I did 3 coats by waiting a couple of hours between coats and it looks great, I don't think it will come off anytime soon. Thanks for the tip, I really appreciate it.

KenNashua March 2, 2013 11:53 AM

The burpee pea fences can be had again for $23 each if you buy two.

START13 code for $10 off
FS61 code for free shipping

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk

rnewste March 2, 2013 12:17 PM

Ken,

Thanks for posting the link.

BTW, we lived near the FAA Center and worked for Nashua Corp. on Franklin St. several years ago. I really miss that area.:(

Raybo

Father'sDaughter March 2, 2013 11:08 PM

[QUOTE=rnewste;331331]
BTW, we lived near the FAA Center and worked for Nashua Corp. on Franklin St. several years ago. I really miss that area.:(

Raybo[/QUOTE]


You really miss the cold, snow, ice....?? ;-)

rnewste March 3, 2013 12:25 PM

No, I miss [B]Lake Winnipesaukee [/B]in the Summer!

Raybo[B]:D
[/B]

elight March 26, 2013 10:32 AM

To update Ken's post above, here are some new Burpee discount codes that work as of today:

20% off storewide (slightly better than the $10 off if ordering two fences) - AFFTW80
Free shipping on orders >$40 (old code expired, this one now works) - RTMNFREE40

Just used both codes together and got two sets of pea fences, including shipping, for $44.80.

Also, Ray, I noticed that the product number for the pea fences in the EarthTainer PDF is slightly off, as it has two of the numbers transposed. It should be 93047, but you have it as 9[B]4[/B]0[B]3[/B]7.

GoGayleGo April 3, 2013 10:02 AM

[QUOTE=bdank;209798]Raybo,
yeah, I thought it was pretty smart of me to think to use the staking system clamps like that. I told my husband to bow down to me as he is usully the one who thinks of these things. :lol:

It holds the cage on very tight too! I'm temped to sell the whole cage idea to earthbox . :D
The clamps are reasonably priced too. I got 4 of them for $5.

You will need to buy some bolts to get it to work. the ones that came with my earthbox staking system rim clamps are too short for this use. I'm using 4 10x24 1-3/4 inch bolts, along with the nuts that came with the clamps, per cage.

Also, I used these [URL="http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=cage+clips&hl=en&rlz=1C1SKPL_enUS411US412&prmd=ivns&biw=1139&bih=921&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&um=1&ie=UTF-8&cid=8962811725497392692&sa=X&ei=s0KqTfvcKcry0gG00pz5CA&ved=0CHUQ8wIwAA#"]cage clips[/URL] to put the two pea fences together. It came out way cheaper than the rope clamps that you use. I have to make 20 cages and that many rope clamps would be expensive.[/QUOTE]


Does anyone know if the EB cage clips will work on a non-EB box? Specifically, an 18-gallon tote?

Or is the zip-tie method just as effective?


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:04 PM.


★ Tomatoville® is a registered trademark of Commerce Holdings, LLC ★ All Content ©2019 Commerce Holdings, LLC ★