Hydroponic information.
 

We don't appear to have a Hydroponic thread, so I'm putting this here hoping "Gardening in the Green" is the right place.
I have just found some info which I should share as it's very clever, and will save time.
Visit here and watch the video at the bottom of the page.[URL="http://www.bigelowbrook.com/Products/GrowGrip/Default.aspx"]http://www.bigelowbrook.com/Products/GrowGrip/Default.aspx[/URL]
Neat eh? A much better way of starting seeds to give you clean roots.

Hi there,
I am growing hydroponicly... :)
Just made the whole setup and in a few days/weeks, all seedlings will be transferred to my dutch buckets.
In my little greenhouse, I use solar activated watering in growbags. (10 plants)
Do you have pics?
Grts

You can reuse hydroton pellets as a grow media (boil them to kill harmful stuff and clean salts off them) and you can start seeds in hydroton if you're careful. They aren't a good fit for some systems but they are reuseable. I really like hydroton for DWC.

The most green way to grow with hydro is to do kratky method lettuce using fish wastewater (from an aquarium for example). I have done that before and it was surprisingly easy and required zero electricity. I was growing cauliflower which was ultimately eaten by the bunnies but it did work.

I think aeroponics would be considered green too even though it uses chemical nutrients because it uses 98% less water than growing in soil.

Im growing hydrponically with the urban farms 10 system this yr.. So far so good. I started my seedling the old fashion way in promix heating pad, and florecenet light. I just popped them out of the cup and washed the promix off and put them in the rockwool. Seems to be working fine

I practice Deep Water Culture myself.. I started a few years back with passive hydroponics: hempy (dutch) buckets, and they got the job done.. I traded up to DWC about two years ago and haven't looked back.. The vigor and growth rate is truly impressive.. What's funny is that indoors I love playing chemist with all the synthetics, but outdoors I wouldn't dream of letting them touch the soil lol..

I personally cut clones rather than continuously popping seed.. I made a cloning setup out of an old tupperware container.. filled 3/4's with a very weak solution and an air-stone.. Just drill out the lid with a multibit, and drop your peat pellets in - roots in 10 days or so..

Im growing outdoors on my patio. I did clone a plant last week. Ha. I cut a piece off a big cheef plant and stuck it in a pot in the system. It looked drooppy for two days but its growing now standing up and is dark green,. its been 4 days

[QUOTE=Mike723;481648]I practice Deep Water Culture myself.. I started a few years back with passive hydroponics: hempy (dutch) buckets, and they got the job done.. I traded up to DWC about two years ago and haven't looked back.. The vigor and growth rate is truly impressive.. What's funny is that indoors I love playing chemist with all the synthetics, but outdoors I wouldn't dream of letting them touch the soil lol..

I personally cut clones rather than continuously popping seed.. I made a cloning setup out of an old tupperware container.. filled 3/4's with a very weak solution and an air-stone.. Just drill out the lid with a multibit, and drop your peat pellets in - roots in 10 days or so..[/QUOTE]

Build one of these

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LK0eUDoairw[/URL]

Roots in 3 days. I think you want to start feeding around day 5. The idea is to starve the plant long enough to make it develop roots (looking for food) and then feed it before it dies. I'm still experimenting to come up with the optimal way to do this.

I'm also still experimenting with transferring aerocloned plants to soil but I think it is totally doable.

Good luck going aero to soil without transplant shock; I couldn't do it. The roots all bunch up together. Something like a rockwool/cocopeat cube would work better I think. The media would go with the transplant into the ground.

I'm transplanting them right into leaf compost. It holds moisture pretty well and I watered them in really well.

I think it's likely they'll just die but I'm hoping to eventually find a good way to do it. I had to get them out of the aero system because I screwed up the pH and they weren't uptaking nutrients. So I planted them without hardening them off.

If they survive it is probably because it's a rainy day today.

Light, fluffy soil like your compost would give them the best chance I think.

[QUOTE=HydroExplorer;481908]Build one of these

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LK0eUDoairw[/URL]

Roots in 3 days. I think you want to start feeding around day 5. The idea is to starve the plant long enough to make it develop roots (looking for food) and then feed it before it dies. I'm still experimenting to come up with the optimal way to do this.

I'm also still experimenting with transferring aerocloned plants to soil but I think it is totally doable.[/QUOTE]

Nah I'm happy with my cloner at the moment.. Not in that much of a rush - gardening is all about patience my friend :yes:

Cloning aeroponically and then transplanting into soil creates added stress and a huge risk of transplant shock as the roots try to adapt.. It IS doable, I did it a few months back with the latest mother I have going, but she wasn't happy for a solid month, and I wouldn't plan on harvesting anything from her.. Certainly not something I'd make a habit out of, as it surely isn't productive. If you're growing out in soil then it would serve you (and the plants) better to clone in soil as well.. Tomatoes would clone in a bucket of tar just about (I'm being facetious) lol .. Super easy to root..

Also, you didn't have to rush the transplant simply due to PH issues.. Just drain the res and make a fresh batch in the future... If you still have lock outs then use a flushing solution like florakleen..

[QUOTE=Cole_Robbie;481922]Good luck going aero to soil without transplant shock; I couldn't do it. The roots all bunch up together. Something like a rockwool/cocopeat cube would work better I think. The media would go with the transplant into the ground.[/QUOTE]

Quick update. My clones transitioned from aero cloner to soil successfully (2 tomatoes 2 mint). I planted them directly into leaf compost, watered them in and then it rained for like 2 or 3 days.

From this I gather that watering is a lot probably important. Also, reduced light might be a factor (was heavy cloud cover and rainy). I also fanned the roots out as best as I could because of your warning about root bunching. I wanted to share that in case it helps you in your endeavors. I was transplanting them from under an LED grow light without hardening them off.

I know they're going to make it because they were very deficient when I planted them and they aren't anymore.

That said, this was my first stab at this and I definitely should have fed the plants before transplanting them. Looking back over my video log I think I should have fed them on day 5.

Good for you, glad it was a success for ya!

[QUOTE=Cole_Robbie;481922]Good luck going aero to soil without transplant shock; I couldn't do it. The roots all bunch up together. Something like a rockwool/cocopeat cube would work better I think. The media would go with the transplant into the ground.[/QUOTE]
Sticking them into a peat pellet is the way to go. I have transplanted quite a few into soil and they don't skip a beat at all. The coco peat pellet works wonder and much better than rockwool in my opinion.

Can one grow tomatoes totally organic in a hydroponic set up? Indoors with lights. I've done a lot of tomato seed starting with a rack and shop lights, no other equipment, so I know that can be done.

Lettuce and some greens, easy to grow is what I'd like to start with but then on to tomatoes. Maybe the Dwarf variety tomatoes if they would be productive enough. I've never done any hydroponics. Just getting into the thinking stage.

Deep Water Culture - is that the same as Dutch buckets?

How noisy is it to have a set up in your house? Just as part of a room, not in a 'grow closet' or inside a zipper tent. A free standing piece of furniture? Actually there is a nice corner in my kitchen that could be converted into a grow station without much carpentry. Yes, I want to grow my own salad bar!!!

Zeroma

I looked into the organic idea, and my understanding of the OMRI rules was that all plastic must be food safe. That sounds great, but if one is using a mag-drive pump to move water, there is no such thing as a food-safe water pump for hydro. That product does not exist.

If you're not trying to get certified and are thus willing to overlook minor details like that, there are organic nutrients for hydro. They are expensive, of course. It is difficult to refine and filter organic fertilizers into a liquid that will not clog up spray lines, tubing and emitters. It is also much more challenging to avoid pythium and root rot, not impossible, just more challenging, especially in DWC.

The easiest way to grow organic tomatoes inside would be to use a pro-mix type of media that was organic and then add organic fertilizers.

Thanks Cole Robbie,

So you are saying organic tomatoes NOT in a hydroponic system?

Not looking to get OMRI certified, just wanted the best information I can find on healthiest plants and if possible, tomatoes.

So DWC would be the most challenging?

Ever since I saw this picture, the idea is still in my head! [url]http://www.treehugger.com/sustainable-product-design/kitchen-nano-garden-hydroponic-hyundai.html[/url]

Thanks

Zeroma

Those look like a step above Micro-Greens. You can do that in 10-20 flats on a shelf, just don't plant as many seeds and let them grow for a few weeks before harvesting. [url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZMG6hATT_I[/url]

I found food grade mag pumps that are plastic on line.
One of the reasons for food grade pumps it to be able to handle boiling fluids.
Who on earth is going to run boiling fluids to their plants.
I find the whole organic certification program lacking in common sense and an organization that hauls in tons of money every year but yet claims to be non profit.
As for a pump for the house I wouldn't worry one bit about whether or not it is food grade to run fertilizer to plants.

The same thing happens with curing/brining meat and fermenting food.
They say dont use metal containers.
This is total BS but they have dumbed the information down so some idiot wont go out and do it in a tin can or galvanized wash tub.

Worth

The only food-grade pumps I found were meant for running melted chocolate fountains. The volume was really low on them, far too low for my use.

Non-hydro organic tomatoes would be a lot easier, in my opinion at least, and cheaper too.

Organic hydroponics is really rare. I won't say impossible, but certainly rare. The problem is that organic fertilizers contain organic matter, which feeds bacteria. Hydro systems have a tendency to get over-run with anaerobic pythium bacteria that cause root rot.

Compare the oxygen available to roots growing through a loose pro-mix with peat and perlite, versus submerged in water. In higher oxygen environments, it is harder for the anaerobic bacteria to take over, which is why organic ferts can work so well in potted plants - you're culturing the good bacteria.

There's no real authority on the exact definition of hydroponics. If it just means "without soil," then most container plants would be hydro, because pro-mix and other typical grow media does not contain any actual dirt. Large-scale operations often use perlite or rockwool, and "run-to-waste." That's just watering from the top and letting the waste water drip away, which is really the same as any potted plant. By the same token, I think straw bale gardening is hydro, too, even though we don't call it that. Also, the Earthbox and other sub-irrigated planters could also be termed "wick hydroponics."

Cole I saw some in the brewing industry.
Why would a person even want a Mag drive pump I know what they are but why would you want one?
Worth

Fish ponds are the most common use. Mag-drive pumps make a lot less heat. As the water temperature rises, it can hold less oxygen, which is bad for either fish or plants.

A common basement sump pump is a much cheaper and more powerful design, but when run constantly, it gets hot. One could certainly use a pump like that in hydro, but it would need to be something like flood and drain, where the pump only runs for a short cycle. A lot of aquaponics setups use flood and drain.

There's a lot of misunderstanding about aeration of hydro reservoirs. People getting started will typically throw a fish tank air pump and bubbler stone into a bucket. We see the bubbles and think that's how the water is getting oxygen. But actually surface tension keeps the air inside the bubble. It doesn't seep out, at least hardly at all. (There are some sewage treatment aerators that use air bubbles, but sewage water tends to have a lot of soap and detergents in it, thus decreasing surface tension.) A hydro bucket bubbler does work, but the aeration comes from the way the bubbles move the water. That's why a water pump is a better aerator than an air pump - water movement is the real key.

Another use for mag drive pumps is for chemicals that absolutely cant be allowed to escape into the environment.
The impeller itself is the same as any other pump from what I have seen.
I have also seen even more complicated pumps in the industry to avoid leaks.
The heating of the water is from cavitation many due to the impeller being ran too fast or the water flowing too fast.
I have seen 1 inch thick valve bodies eaten completely eaten through in just a few months due to this.

Here is a short video explaining the mag drive pump showing how it works.
Pay close attention to how it cools itself with e the fluid it is pumping.
If for any reason these pathways get stopped up the bearings will burn up.
Worth

[url]https://youtu.be/fFXTioC1oJQ[/url]

[QUOTE=Rajun Gardener;595374]Those look like a step above Micro-Greens. You can do that in 10-20 flats on a shelf, just don't plant as many seeds and let them grow for a few weeks before harvesting. [url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZMG6hATT_I[/url][/QUOTE]

Rajun, that would be way more than 2 people could use. LOL I just saw that kitchen set up a few years ago and thought how nice it would be to grow a little in the kitchen. Ebb and Flow or something similar with a very scaled down version of that idea might still be fun.

A lot more work than just have a few pots of herbs on the window ledge. Which I can't do anyway as I have no kitchen window or its ledge! I have just a corner space that is still wanting to be more useful space.

Thanks

Z