Broccoli vs. Cauliflower

May 16, 2013

I started my broc and cauliflower inside in March, under the same conditions, on the same kitchen counter, same lights, in the same type of soil, pots, etc...planted them out last month at the same time in the same garden, within feet of each other, all with drip irrigation, no difference in anything that I can see. And now the broccoli is thriving, and already putting out small buds. But the cauliflower has just sat there, not growing, one died altogether and others look like they are about to follow suit. They are not much bigger than the were when they were set out, and look much sadder.
Any ideas? What am I doing wrong? I thought these two were a lot alike in their requirements, apparently not.

RebelRidin · May 17, 2013

I believe you were right in your expectation that they wanted much the same condiotions. That has always been my experience. I've never seen on thrive and the other not. How tall/big/sets of leaves were they and brocolli when set out and how big are they and the brocolli in the month since you set them out. How do they look sadder? Do you see any yellowing of the leaves?

May 17, 2013

I will get some pictures tonight and post them.

May 18, 2013

Okay I think I've got this picture thing now. I hope. This shows the size comparison between the cauliflowers (follow the arrows) and the more obvious broccoli.

May 18, 2013

LOL! Apparently not.

May 18, 2013

Trying again. If anyone was watching they're probably long gone by now!

Tracydr · May 18, 2013

Strange. I've heard cauliflower is trickier than broccoli but that's mainly getting it to make heads. I would think their growth rate would be more similar.

May 18, 2013

It worked!!

The cauliflower at the top of that picture had collapsed, I'm thinking cutworms? I pulled it out and took a pic of the root but they all came out blurry. Here's one effort - it had only put out a few root "hairs", it was mainly stub. But if it was cutworms, shouldn't *all* the plants be affected?

Below is the root and if I do this right, another shot of broc v. cauliflower.

Thanks in advance for any opinions/suggestions!
Ronaye

Redbaron · May 18, 2013

That happened to some of mine. Even the pale purplish leaves. It is a similar thing to damping off I think, but in the roots. Its tricky because it looks like nutrient deficiency, but the reason it is deficient is the roots not the nutrients in the soil. Too wet and got a bacteria in the roots. I let them dry out almost to the point of wilting first, then hit them with a good compost tea made with inoculants as I transplanted them in the field. Over 1/2 snapped right out of it pretty fast. Believe me, some looked so bad I just knew they had no chance. But they are catching up as we speak.

PS It isn't a difference between broccoli and cauliflower per se. It has happened to my broccoli cabbage, Kohlrabi etc before too. It can happen to any brassica but some cultivars are more resistant than others.

KarenO · May 18, 2013

Cabbage root maggots will cause those symptoms of stunting, foliage discoloration and wilting by damaging the roots. Adult cabbage flies about 1/2 the size of a housefly and their Larvae look like tiny grains of rice. have a check, common pest of cruciferous plants. might be the problem.
KO

MrBig46 · May 18, 2013

It is cardinal difference between the planting of cauliflower and broccoli. The planting of cauliflowe is most exacting from all vegetables of family Brassica oleracea (cauliflover,kohlrabi, cabbage, savoy cabbage, brussels sprouts, broccoli etc.). Cauliflover is exacting on the structure of fundation soil (hoe), fertilization , dressing, etc. I don´t plant cauliflower more than twenty years (for its exacting).
Vladimír

RebelRidin · May 18, 2013

I have also had that happen to a few plants here and there from time to time. Never had it happen to many at once or all of only one type though. I think it was just luck of the draw. Some years will be better so some have to be poorer I guess to balance things out.

Don't get too discouraged. I would encourage you not to give up on cauliflower. It is really satisfying to harvest their dense creamy heads.

MrBig46 · May 19, 2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by RebelRidin

I have also had that happen to a few plants here and there from time to time. Never had it happen to many at once or all of only one type though. I think it was just luck of the draw. Some years will be better so some have to be poorer I guess to balance things out.

Don't get too discouraged. I would encourage you not to give up on cauliflower. It is really satisfying to harvest their dense creamy heads.

The question: broccoli vs cauliflover
My disputatious report is not about its, if cauliflower planted or not. I am only submitting that the planting of cauliflower is harder than the planting broccoli.
A nice day Vladimír

tjg911 · May 19, 2013

i grew cauliflower one or two years the heck with that. i have great success with anything i grow but cauliflower was one thing that did not do well. i can't justify the space for 1 head of cauliflower. i figured it's like broccoli, cabbage and brussels sprouts and the 1st 2 are a cinch to grow, bs did ok but the harvest is too low to justify.

in the 1st picture if that's both broccoli and cauliflower they are way too close to each other. broccoli plants can get really large, mine are typically 2-2.5' wide and 2.5-3' tall by late july.

i see this in cabbage more than broccoli but it applies to both. if your plants are limp and wilting in the heat of the day and you water to no avail you have root maggots. you can kill them by mixing about 2-3 tablespoons of wood ashes NOT COAL into 2 gallons of water and watering the plants. one time does it, you'll see the plant recover the next day. i have this problem with cabbage especially the 1st batch. so far no sign but in the next few weeks i'm sure i'll have to do this. if you don't you'll most likely lose the plant. if you don't have any wood ashes ask someone that uses a fireplace or wood stove.

tom

b54red · May 19, 2013

I grow two crops of broccoli and cauliflower every year and usually broccoli outperforms but not every time. Sometimes the cauliflower will do great and the broccoli will remain small and head very early with small heads. They both like frequent fertilizing and cool weather.

That picture of the roots does look like something damaged the main stem.

May 16, 2013	#1
Ronaye Guest Posts: n/a	Broccoli vs. Cauliflower I started my broc and cauliflower inside in March, under the same conditions, on the same kitchen counter, same lights, in the same type of soil, pots, etc...planted them out last month at the same time in the same garden, within feet of each other, all with drip irrigation, no difference in anything that I can see. And now the broccoli is thriving, and already putting out small buds. But the cauliflower has just sat there, not growing, one died altogether and others look like they are about to follow suit. They are not much bigger than the were when they were set out, and look much sadder. Any ideas? What am I doing wrong? I thought these two were a lot alike in their requirements, apparently not.

May 17, 2013	#2
RebelRidin Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Maryland's Eastern Shore Posts: 993	I believe you were right in your expectation that they wanted much the same condiotions. That has always been my experience. I've never seen on thrive and the other not. How tall/big/sets of leaves were they and brocolli when set out and how big are they and the brocolli in the month since you set them out. How do they look sadder? Do you see any yellowing of the leaves? __________________ George _____________________________ "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is it’s natural manure." Thomas Jefferson, 1787 Last edited by RebelRidin; May 17, 2013 at 07:40 AM. Reason: leaf color

May 18, 2013	#9
Redbaron Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 4,488	That happened to some of mine. Even the pale purplish leaves. It is a similar thing to damping off I think, but in the roots. Its tricky because it looks like nutrient deficiency, but the reason it is deficient is the roots not the nutrients in the soil. Too wet and got a bacteria in the roots. I let them dry out almost to the point of wilting first, then hit them with a good compost tea made with inoculants as I transplanted them in the field. Over 1/2 snapped right out of it pretty fast. Believe me, some looked so bad I just knew they had no chance. But they are catching up as we speak. PS It isn't a difference between broccoli and cauliflower per se. It has happened to my broccoli cabbage, Kohlrabi etc before too. It can happen to any brassica but some cultivars are more resistant than others. __________________ Scott AKA The Redbaron "Permaculture is a philosophy of working with, rather than against nature; of protracted & thoughtful observation rather than protracted & thoughtless labour; & of looking at plants & animals in all their functions, rather than treating any area as a single-product system." Bill Mollison co-founder of permaculture

May 18, 2013	#12
RebelRidin Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Maryland's Eastern Shore Posts: 993	I have also had that happen to a few plants here and there from time to time. Never had it happen to many at once or all of only one type though. I think it was just luck of the draw. Some years will be better so some have to be poorer I guess to balance things out. Don't get too discouraged. I would encourage you not to give up on cauliflower. It is really satisfying to harvest their dense creamy heads. __________________ George _____________________________ "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is it’s natural manure." Thomas Jefferson, 1787

May 19, 2013	#14
tjg911 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: zone 5b northwest connecticut Posts: 2,570	i grew cauliflower one or two years the heck with that. i have great success with anything i grow but cauliflower was one thing that did not do well. i can't justify the space for 1 head of cauliflower. i figured it's like broccoli, cabbage and brussels sprouts and the 1st 2 are a cinch to grow, bs did ok but the harvest is too low to justify. in the 1st picture if that's both broccoli and cauliflower they are way too close to each other. broccoli plants can get really large, mine are typically 2-2.5' wide and 2.5-3' tall by late july. i see this in cabbage more than broccoli but it applies to both. if your plants are limp and wilting in the heat of the day and you water to no avail you have root maggots. you can kill them by mixing about 2-3 tablespoons of wood ashes NOT COAL into 2 gallons of water and watering the plants. one time does it, you'll see the plant recover the next day. i have this problem with cabbage especially the 1st batch. so far no sign but in the next few weeks i'm sure i'll have to do this. if you don't you'll most likely lose the plant. if you don't have any wood ashes ask someone that uses a fireplace or wood stove. tom __________________ I need a hero I’m holding out for a hero ‘til the end of the night He’s gotta be strong And he’s gotta be fast And he’s gotta be fresh from the fight I need a hero I’m holding out for a hero ‘til the morning light He’s gotta be sure And it’s gotta be soon And he’s gotta be larger than life

May 18, 2013	#7
Tracydr Tomatovillian™ Join Date: May 2011 Location: Laurinburg, North Carolina, zone 7 Posts: 3,207	Strange. I've heard cauliflower is trickier than broccoli but that's mainly getting it to make heads. I would think their growth rate would be more similar.

May 18, 2013	#10
KarenO Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Vancouver Island Posts: 5,927	Cabbage root maggots will cause those symptoms of stunting, foliage discoloration and wilting by damaging the roots. Adult cabbage flies about 1/2 the size of a housefly and their Larvae look like tiny grains of rice. have a check, common pest of cruciferous plants. might be the problem. KO

May 18, 2013	#11
MrBig46 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Czech republic Posts: 2,528	It is cardinal difference between the planting of cauliflower and broccoli. The planting of cauliflowe is most exacting from all vegetables of family Brassica oleracea (cauliflover,kohlrabi, cabbage, savoy cabbage, brussels sprouts, broccoli etc.). Cauliflover is exacting on the structure of fundation soil (hoe), fertilization , dressing, etc. I don´t plant cauliflower more than twenty years (for its exacting). Vladimír

May 19, 2013	#15
b54red Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Alabama Posts: 7,068	I grow two crops of broccoli and cauliflower every year and usually broccoli outperforms but not every time. Sometimes the cauliflower will do great and the broccoli will remain small and head very early with small heads. They both like frequent fertilizing and cool weather. That picture of the roots does look like something damaged the main stem.