Flea Beatles

[miniedmo]

Do you guys know what I will have to use to get rid of these buggers. I had pruned some lower limbs on my plants yesterday and noticed these little black bugs on the lower leaves. They jump just like a flea. It is very hot here right now and have not had any rain, so I am waiting to spray with anything until the temps drop a little. I would just like to know the safest way to rid myself of these bugs.

[peppereater]

Safer's soap is great for most pests, and Neem oil is an excellent contact spray that also acts as a repellent.

[feldon30]

I finally managed to get some "Fruit Tree Spray" by Green Light.

What is this product and why should you care?

It is Neem oil and Pyrethrin extract in the concentrations normally mentioned in "Neem II" or "Rose II" sprays made by Green Light. You see, Neem II and Rose II are organic sprays that cost about $8 and contain both Neem and Pyrethrin. The person I spoke to at Green Light assures me that the Pyrethrin adds a significant kick. I mentioned that I really want to buy a concentrate and that they only seem to sell Neem oil concentrate without the pyrethrin. He said to look for the Fruit Tree spray. I said is that safe on tomatoes and he said sure, it's the same as Neem II just a concentrate.

So now I have a bottle of this stuff for $10 which will produce probably 10 16 GALLONS. It would cost me over $300 $500 in bottles of Neem II to produce that quantity ($8 x 64).

I don't intend to spray unless I see problems since Neem is not really a preventative to my knowledge.

[Adenn1]

Feldon:

Went to the Green Light website after reading your post...the fruit tree concentrate states that a pint of it makes 16 gallons...and they note that it can be used on vegetables...

Think I am going shopping in the morning...

[peppereater]

Great to know. As to the Neem being preventative, it does have a repellent affect, but I don't know how long it persists. It is said to be a very effective fungicide as well.

[miniedmo]

Thanks you guys, I sprayed with safer soap today and am going to see how that works, if not I will try the fruit tree spray.

[username5]

Originally Posted by feldon27

I don't intend to spray unless I see problems since Neem is not really a preventative to my knowledge.

I just wanted to weigh in here with some totally ancedotal experience.

I would say neem is *best* used as a preventative.

Why?

Well, last year I was reading up on neem and ordered some Safer Bio-Neem (a horticultural oil with an extract of azadirachtin (the anti everything ingredient in the oil)).

I have trialed it in my yard/gardens this year and found it to provide best results used proactively.

As far as it's anti fungal properties I have used it on two asian pear trees that suffer each year from some unidentified fungal pathogen. This year the pathogen was light on one and moderate to heavy on the other. I sprayed with bio-neem as both trees have had insect pest problems in the past.

On the tree with light fungal presence the use of bio-neem provided excellent control. On the tree with moderate presence it seemed to provide no control. My hypothesis is that the neem didn't kill the fungi, it limited it's spread. On the lightly affected tree the fungi wasn't established enough to survive with the biomass (colonization area) it was limited to.

On hostas I have one bed that is plagued by slugs every year. While completely ancedotal (I have never seen neem recomended for slug control) I sprayed the highly slug prone bed as soon as the first hosta leaves were emerging and I saw the first 'hole' in the leaf. I sprayed only one time and there has been no slug damage since. In another bed I also sprayed only one and I do see some leaf damage, but very minor (so far).

My hypothesis is that the bed with most problems had overwintering slugs that were either killed or discouraged very early on and as a result now that the heat is on, they haven't migrated back in. Again, I credit the early control as the reason for success, not the curative effect as neem doesn't last long (a week or one good rainfall from what I read).

Also, some pests that are highly mobile such as japanese beetles seem to attract their families by releasing chemicals that signal a food source has been found. By closing off the early season feeding, these pests don't emit the chemicals indicating a buffet has been located so populations may be reduced.

Once a heavy infestation of anything has established I do not find neem effective. Simply put neem doesn't kill anything quickly except when used as a smothering agent like any other horticultural oil.

So far I find it's most effective use as a preventative used to discourage the early season breeders from establishing colonies and preventing the early scouts from telling others about the bounty in my yard.