Copyrighted photo thief - Dr. Tomato - Page 8

hmacdona · November 9, 2012

I have been reading this thread and getting more and more worked up about what is happening.

On a professional level, I have been involved in copyright infringement issues with another competing organization for infringing on our trademark advertising, trademark names, designation names etc. This came when I served on the board of a professional organization. The offending organization was taking a bully approach with us because they were betting we wouldn't spend the money to legally defend our position. We were a small professional organization which represented quality professionals (not just anyone could belong...you had to meet quality criteria and anyone with a history of client complaints or penalties imposed was not welcome). Our members had the best reputations in the business. They on the otherhand were a big organization, with loads of money, and a massive membership base that had no quality control whatsoever. They were deliberately using versions of our trademarked representations to mislead a consumer into thinking they were dealing with "our" quality members. A bit of a david and goliah dynamic going on. I see similarities in what's happening here. TVillians are all about the integrity, quality, the membership of likeminded individuals and to me, the most important thing...is preserving your good reputations and not letting anyone of "lessor" quality hijack your reputation.

What I learned is that you have to maintain a fairly aggressive campaign to advise the offending party they are infringing on your copyright or trademark and they are to cease immediately.

When the offending parties were unresponsive and deliberately ignored our requests...our lawyers advised us to issue a "News Release" announcing to the public something like this...... that the organization "insert your name here" has become aware that "so and so organization" is using advertising or phrases and representations that we believe to be a violation of our organizations trademark. We believe that these violations are intended to mislead the consumer. We have made numerous attempts to contact this organization to discuss the issue and request they cease the violating activities. They have chosen not to respond and continue with the offending advertising. As such, protecting consumer interests are our highest priority, and we wish to inform our colleagues, consumers and members that we fully intend to deal with these violations with every legal means available.

We will of course, welcome "offending company" to respond to our requests.

For further information, please contact.......

You get the jest. There are many newswire services around and any organization can issue a news release. You see it all the time and it's really inexpensive and I think many are free as the newswire services are all electronic nowadays. It didn't cost us a dime...just had to buy the lawyer a beer to have that discussion (luckily we had a lawyer that didn't charge us full rate all the time because he believed in what we did).

The lawyers philosophy was this, they're big, you're small and we need to be smart about this because you don't want to break the bank in bringing justice. We're now going to shame them into doing the right thing. News releases reach literally millions of canadians and americans via newswire services they belong to. The lawyer felt there was no risk of libel as our attempts at contacting them previously were well documented. Thankfully this got their attention and we won. Now they know we mean business and we will be as irritating and embarrassing as a burning rash if they try this again. Hasn't raised it's ugly head in a while, but we have to watch them constantly through google alerts as was suggested early. I'm no longer involved in that board, but that was only a couple of years ago.

We had a plan B if the news release didn't work as well as we couldn't risk losing our trademarks...it represented everything we were as an organization.

obviously legal advice is always needed before ever issuing things like news releases, but it seems to me you folks have a very strong position on everything your trying to do. You can even vouch for each others pictures....wow!

Without defensive action you can actually lose your rights. I'm speaking from a Canadian perspective and I have no idea if it works the same way in the US with copyrights and trademarks. "You have to protect you marks" is the phrase they use to describe the responsibility to uphold. It seems to me, you folks have done an amazing job at taking the "offensive" on the offending party here. This Dr. Tomato is playing with fire, and he's going to lose because of the passion of this group

If he doesn't intend to put himself out of business, he'll cave and do the right thing one day...as long as you keep making noise. If he continues to do nothing, the noise will kill his business since he is running an internet shop.

Having said all of this, I'm wondering if there is some sort of government consumer affairs or consumer protection agency in the US? You know, a division of the state department or federal government that is there solely to protect the interests of consumers? That was our plan B. If there is such an organization, you may find that they will help your cause. Afterall, each and everyone one of you is a consumer affected by this, and many of you are small business owners that are also impacted by that. These government organizations are there to protect your interests when consumers are having issues with offending organizations. Might be worth checking into this. They have in house lawyers and advocates that are there to fight against bully organizations and help consumers maintain their rights. Your tax dollars pay for this.
Most people are not aware that these goverment organizations exist and are available to you to be your "big brother" so to speak. They might be more than happy to look into this on your behalf and make this stop.

Wouldn't it be nice if there was a t-ville member that was also a lawyer, that was willing to donate a couple of hours of pro-bono work to put Dr. Tomato on notice on official legal letterhead. The lawyers I've worked with have been very masterful at writing these types of letters..Brilliant actually...they love to sink their teeth into bully situations and play with them until they give up. It doesn't take a lot of time to do that. I'm definitely no lawyer, but if I were, I'd volunteer my time for you.....LOL Heck if anyone wanted to start a small fund to pay for a couple of hours of legal assistance on this matter, I would even contribute. I'm sure lots of others would too.

I know I'm babbling at this point....but these kind of people pi** me off. Pardon my french. When people like this, that lack ethics and impact good people...pi** me off, I usually make it my mission to teach them a lesson. Phew...hows that for saying what's on someone's mind.

Thanks for listening and keep up the great work. Keep making noise and be that embarrasing rash that will cause this Dr. Tomato to finally step up and do the right thing.

hmacdona · November 9, 2012

One quick little observation to add. It seems to me this discussion was inactive for quite some time. When the discussion was active, this Dr. Tomato started to back away and change a few things. Once the discussion became inactive, your Dr. Tomato showed his bad behaviour again because he saw an opportunity and took it. When discussion like these go inactive, they disappear on the internet. Adding an update once in a while to the discussion will keep this thread near the top of google searches. He will notice and of course he's going to worry that if anyone that was googling his company before deciding to buy from him, they might see this conversation. My two bits...keep this thread alive...even just to say "bump" every once in a while to keep it near the top of google searches. It may help to keep this bad behaviour in check. This will become a bit of a reference for any consumer that might be checking him out before giving a credit card on his website. Just my two bits.

SEAMSFASTER · November 13, 2012

Thanks for the encouragement and great info. Heather!

I just checked his new website again. Now he has 5 pictures that he could have only lifted from my website - actually only 4! If I were not so upset, I would be laughing - he used the exact same picture (one of mine) to depict two very different varieties. As if no one would notice.

And he lifted pictures from Tatiana's TOMATObase, including the big Rebecca Sebastian's Bull Bag shown here: http://t.tatianastomatobase.com:88/w...n%27s_Bull_Bag. I recognize at least two pics from TomatoFest, and I swear I've seen most of the others somewhere.

Yes, someone send this guy a camera for Christmas!

Looks like his business, Duncan Greenhouse & Seed, is now on Facebook.

oooh, now I'm really ticked off! He's got my favorite pic from 2009 listed in his public Photobucket album!

http://s660.beta.photobucket.com/use...69560918092362

Don't know how long it will be there, as I just sent him a strongly worded feedback comment!

Oh yeah - I just remembered, I use that sloppy little sign as a bookmark and I still have the old scales! Just cuz I can, here's a pic I just took. Different tomato though (picked green five days ago due to pending hard freeze), and I use much more accurate digital scales these days.

So what do you think? If this guy likes my pictures so much, why doesn't he just post a hyperlink!?

nativeplanter · December 31, 2012

I bumped into this thread while searching the forum for info on Sioux tomato flavor, then got sidetracked on something else, etc. etc.

Not sure if it is the same guy, but if you put "duncan seed" in amazon, it seems that everything that comes up has a photo from somewhere else, such as Tomato Grower's Supply, Seeds of Change, Whiteflower Farm, Thompson & Morgan, Parks Seed, etc. Even Flickr images.

I've learned a lot from you folks here, and from the websites/webstores of people on this thread, and really appreciate all the time and effort you have dedicated. Not sure this entity is using your photos, but I thought you'd want to keep tabs on him.

Thanks for all you do both on this forum and on your own websites. I'll be placing my seed orders for this year soon, and appreciate your photos and descriptions greatly.

November 9, 2012	#106
hmacdona Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Calgary, AB Canada (Zone 3A) Posts: 443	I have been reading this thread and getting more and more worked up about what is happening. On a professional level, I have been involved in copyright infringement issues with another competing organization for infringing on our trademark advertising, trademark names, designation names etc. This came when I served on the board of a professional organization. The offending organization was taking a bully approach with us because they were betting we wouldn't spend the money to legally defend our position. We were a small professional organization which represented quality professionals (not just anyone could belong...you had to meet quality criteria and anyone with a history of client complaints or penalties imposed was not welcome). Our members had the best reputations in the business. They on the otherhand were a big organization, with loads of money, and a massive membership base that had no quality control whatsoever. They were deliberately using versions of our trademarked representations to mislead a consumer into thinking they were dealing with "our" quality members. A bit of a david and goliah dynamic going on. I see similarities in what's happening here. TVillians are all about the integrity, quality, the membership of likeminded individuals and to me, the most important thing...is preserving your good reputations and not letting anyone of "lessor" quality hijack your reputation. What I learned is that you have to maintain a fairly aggressive campaign to advise the offending party they are infringing on your copyright or trademark and they are to cease immediately. When the offending parties were unresponsive and deliberately ignored our requests...our lawyers advised us to issue a "News Release" announcing to the public something like this...... that the organization "insert your name here" has become aware that "so and so organization" is using advertising or phrases and representations that we believe to be a violation of our organizations trademark. We believe that these violations are intended to mislead the consumer. We have made numerous attempts to contact this organization to discuss the issue and request they cease the violating activities. They have chosen not to respond and continue with the offending advertising. As such, protecting consumer interests are our highest priority, and we wish to inform our colleagues, consumers and members that we fully intend to deal with these violations with every legal means available. We will of course, welcome "offending company" to respond to our requests. For further information, please contact....... You get the jest. There are many newswire services around and any organization can issue a news release. You see it all the time and it's really inexpensive and I think many are free as the newswire services are all electronic nowadays. It didn't cost us a dime...just had to buy the lawyer a beer to have that discussion (luckily we had a lawyer that didn't charge us full rate all the time because he believed in what we did). The lawyers philosophy was this, they're big, you're small and we need to be smart about this because you don't want to break the bank in bringing justice. We're now going to shame them into doing the right thing. News releases reach literally millions of canadians and americans via newswire services they belong to. The lawyer felt there was no risk of libel as our attempts at contacting them previously were well documented. Thankfully this got their attention and we won. Now they know we mean business and we will be as irritating and embarrassing as a burning rash if they try this again. Hasn't raised it's ugly head in a while, but we have to watch them constantly through google alerts as was suggested early. I'm no longer involved in that board, but that was only a couple of years ago. We had a plan B if the news release didn't work as well as we couldn't risk losing our trademarks...it represented everything we were as an organization. obviously legal advice is always needed before ever issuing things like news releases, but it seems to me you folks have a very strong position on everything your trying to do. You can even vouch for each others pictures....wow! Without defensive action you can actually lose your rights. I'm speaking from a Canadian perspective and I have no idea if it works the same way in the US with copyrights and trademarks. "You have to protect you marks" is the phrase they use to describe the responsibility to uphold. It seems to me, you folks have done an amazing job at taking the "offensive" on the offending party here. This Dr. Tomato is playing with fire, and he's going to lose because of the passion of this group If he doesn't intend to put himself out of business, he'll cave and do the right thing one day...as long as you keep making noise. If he continues to do nothing, the noise will kill his business since he is running an internet shop. Having said all of this, I'm wondering if there is some sort of government consumer affairs or consumer protection agency in the US? You know, a division of the state department or federal government that is there solely to protect the interests of consumers? That was our plan B. If there is such an organization, you may find that they will help your cause. Afterall, each and everyone one of you is a consumer affected by this, and many of you are small business owners that are also impacted by that. These government organizations are there to protect your interests when consumers are having issues with offending organizations. Might be worth checking into this. They have in house lawyers and advocates that are there to fight against bully organizations and help consumers maintain their rights. Your tax dollars pay for this. Most people are not aware that these goverment organizations exist and are available to you to be your "big brother" so to speak. They might be more than happy to look into this on your behalf and make this stop. Wouldn't it be nice if there was a t-ville member that was also a lawyer, that was willing to donate a couple of hours of pro-bono work to put Dr. Tomato on notice on official legal letterhead. The lawyers I've worked with have been very masterful at writing these types of letters..Brilliant actually...they love to sink their teeth into bully situations and play with them until they give up. It doesn't take a lot of time to do that. I'm definitely no lawyer, but if I were, I'd volunteer my time for you.....LOL Heck if anyone wanted to start a small fund to pay for a couple of hours of legal assistance on this matter, I would even contribute. I'm sure lots of others would too. I know I'm babbling at this point....but these kind of people pi me off. Pardon my french. When people like this, that lack ethics and impact good people...pi me off, I usually make it my mission to teach them a lesson. Phew...hows that for saying what's on someone's mind. Thanks for listening and keep up the great work. Keep making noise and be that embarrasing rash that will cause this Dr. Tomato to finally step up and do the right thing. Last edited by hmacdona; November 10, 2012 at 12:08 AM.

November 9, 2012	#107
hmacdona Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Calgary, AB Canada (Zone 3A) Posts: 443	One quick little observation to add. It seems to me this discussion was inactive for quite some time. When the discussion was active, this Dr. Tomato started to back away and change a few things. Once the discussion became inactive, your Dr. Tomato showed his bad behaviour again because he saw an opportunity and took it. When discussion like these go inactive, they disappear on the internet. Adding an update once in a while to the discussion will keep this thread near the top of google searches. He will notice and of course he's going to worry that if anyone that was googling his company before deciding to buy from him, they might see this conversation. My two bits...keep this thread alive...even just to say "bump" every once in a while to keep it near the top of google searches. It may help to keep this bad behaviour in check. This will become a bit of a reference for any consumer that might be checking him out before giving a credit card on his website. Just my two bits.

November 13, 2012	#108
SEAMSFASTER Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: American Fork, Utah Posts: 160	Thanks for the encouragement and great info. Heather! I just checked his new website again. Now he has 5 pictures that he could have only lifted from my website - actually only 4! If I were not so upset, I would be laughing - he used the exact same picture (one of mine) to depict two very different varieties. As if no one would notice. And he lifted pictures from Tatiana's TOMATObase, including the big Rebecca Sebastian's Bull Bag shown here: http://t.tatianastomatobase.com:88/w...n%27s_Bull_Bag. I recognize at least two pics from TomatoFest, and I swear I've seen most of the others somewhere. Yes, someone send this guy a camera for Christmas! Looks like his business, Duncan Greenhouse & Seed, is now on Facebook. oooh, now I'm really ticked off! He's got my favorite pic from 2009 listed in his public Photobucket album! http://s660.beta.photobucket.com/use...69560918092362 Don't know how long it will be there, as I just sent him a strongly worded feedback comment! Oh yeah - I just remembered, I use that sloppy little sign as a bookmark and I still have the old scales! Just cuz I can, here's a pic I just took. Different tomato though (picked green five days ago due to pending hard freeze), and I use much more accurate digital scales these days. So what do you think? If this guy likes my pictures so much, why doesn't he just post a hyperlink!?

December 31, 2012	#109
nativeplanter Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Hampton, VA Posts: 86	I bumped into this thread while searching the forum for info on Sioux tomato flavor, then got sidetracked on something else, etc. etc. Not sure if it is the same guy, but if you put "duncan seed" in amazon, it seems that everything that comes up has a photo from somewhere else, such as Tomato Grower's Supply, Seeds of Change, Whiteflower Farm, Thompson & Morgan, Parks Seed, etc. Even Flickr images. I've learned a lot from you folks here, and from the websites/webstores of people on this thread, and really appreciate all the time and effort you have dedicated. Not sure this entity is using your photos, but I thought you'd want to keep tabs on him. Thanks for all you do both on this forum and on your own websites. I'll be placing my seed orders for this year soon, and appreciate your photos and descriptions greatly.