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Old February 25, 2020   #1
TomatoDon
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Default Original Goliath and Old Fashioned Goliath

What is the difference between the Original Goliath and the Old Fashioned Goliath? Seeds are available for both.

I didn't realize that Goliath is an heirloom variety, dating back to the late 1800's and I've been growing them for years, but now I wonder which one I'm growing. I think I'm growing the Original, since the description in one seed catalog says the Old Fashioned Goliath matures in 78 days and the "fruits are oblate, a little bit flattened, with slightly rough shoulders."

The same catalog says the Original Goliath matures in 65 days and has a, "virtually blemish-free exterior from tall vigorous plants that produce yield after yield, and modern disease resistance makes Goliath widely adaptable."

I'm hoping someone can help educate me on these two, which is somewhat confusing due to the similar names. Which one is the most common that we now see for sale in nurseries, WalMart, Home Depot, Lowe's, etc.

Thanks!
Don
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Old February 25, 2020   #2
Marcus1
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Don, I have been growing Goliaths for about 20 years and have always used the F1 (original ?). Last year when I ordered seeds, by mistake I ordered Old Fashioned Goliath (heirloom). Big difference, the original like the description above was almost always blemish free. Last year the Old Fashioned produced big tomatoes but had slight ribs and were a little flatter. Didn't have both last year to compare only the heirloom but did have Big Beef, which is almost the same as the Goliath F1 in my garden. I prune to 2 stems in remesh cages attached to t-posts. When harvest starts pruning ends, no time. The old fashioned Goliath went out of control to the point a couple plants actually tipped the t-posts over. They were later than the Big Beefs, I'd say just as productive, but the flavor was not there. They were softer fleshed and kind of mealy didn't pick hardly any for my stand had to many others that tasted better. Won't make the same mistake again, am sticking to the F1.

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Old February 25, 2020   #3
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I just checked my HPS catalog and all 6 of the Goliath varieties are listed as HYBRID. So wherever you saw info about it being from the 1800s, it was wrong.

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Old February 25, 2020   #4
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This is from Tomato Grower's Supply. Is this the same thing we are discussing?
http://www.tomatogrowers.com/GOLIATH/productinfo/5735/
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Old February 25, 2020   #5
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This is from Reimer Seeds:
http://www.reimerseeds.com/goliath-tomato.aspx
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Old February 25, 2020   #6
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Here's another, which says "not to be confused with Goliath hybrid." Now, I'm totally confused.

http://www.tradewindsfruit.com/goliath-tomato-seeds
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Old February 25, 2020   #7
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Tatiana's has all the versions explained: go to tatianastomatobase.com and search under informational database, tomatoes and click on G and find Goliath. She lists history and seed sources. Each of the four versions are there.

I grew Goliath last year from seeds sold by Tania and it was the large heirloom style with lumps, bumps and ridges. Excellent flavor and production.
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Old February 25, 2020   #8
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If you look at the SeedsnSuch website it says Golioth Original is the variety Pio which is the European variety of Big Beef. It also says that Old Fashioned Golioth is the variety Beef Maestro. It is also clearly stated in the names that both of these Golioths are Hybrid. So what has happened here is some renaming as a gimmick to sell some supposedly related varieties. Apparently it works.
I also read somewhere that there was a very old heirloom named Golioth which was a great producer of large tomatoes.
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Old February 26, 2020   #9
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Here is the page at HPS (a Jungs company) with all the Goliath varieties. As you can see it;s quite different from those others listed. I was unaware of those. Yes I would say some renaming somewhere. https://www.hpsseed.com/category/s?keyword=goliath

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Old February 26, 2020   #10
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And as you see from HPS, all they list are the hybrids. They all look the same: small, round, red or orange and I would bet tasting like a grocery store tomato. Goliath (heirloom) would be the variety to choose.
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Old March 27, 2020   #11
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Default Goliath

Neighbor tailgates Goliath and has had 200-300 every spring as long as I can remember. His look very much like Better Boy in size and shape. But the plant is more productive. The fruit appear to be avg 10-12 oz with the plants suckered to two stems.
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Old March 28, 2020   #12
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The Goliath hybrid is king here. Everyone that grows them sells out as fast as they can pick them. The ones we have are typically the largest "beefsteak" type grown in our area and I regularly pick them at a pound and larger.. They definitely don't taste like bland grocery store gassed tomatoes. These are bursting with old-time back-yard flavor and everyone loves them.

Until this thread, I wasn't sure of the specific variety, especially when the OP or heirloom tag came into play. I believe, specifically, it is this tomato, as listed in Reimer Seeds: Old Fashioned Goliath Tomato 78 days. Solanum lycopersicum. (F1) The plant produces good yields of 1 to 2 lb red tomatoes. They are very sweet, juicy, and flavorful. It has all the flavor of a fine heirloom variety. Perfect for salads, slicing, and sandwiches.

The ones we grow are not "sweet" but have that classic back yard taste with jut the right amount of acid flavor. The most popular ones in our area, for back-yard growing and market selling are Goliath, Big Beef, Better Boy, Cherokee Purple, and Brandywine (I grow the Sudduth strain.)

Thanks for all the input!
Don
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Old April 5, 2020   #13
bigpinks
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Default Goliath

I have tried the hybrid Goliath(from neighbor mentioned above) but they were significantly less productive/harder to grow than Big Beef. My soil is clay and doesnt drain well. Cherokee Purple wont produce there at all. But my large pinks and yellow/reds thrive. Are Goliath tomatoes tastier than Big Beef? I also have good luck with Sun Sugar.
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Old April 6, 2020   #14
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I'm in the minority here, but I think in a blind taste test that hardly anyone could tell the difference in taste among most of the beefsteak type. People in my area all know about Better Boy and that's what they ask for most of the time. I like them fine because I ate them for years and they always tasted good. Plus, they produce a lot and I sell buckets of them as green tomatoes and buckets of them for canners.

In simple terms, I think of the Big Beef as an improvement to the Better Boy and very similar. I think of Goliath Hybrid as similar to Big Beef, but an improvement over it.

When you pick similar sizes of these three and put them in a five gallon bucket it would be difficult to determine one from another. In a blind taste test, it would be difficult to determine one from another. Some experienced tomato connoisseurs might could, but it would be difficult for the average person.

Goliath is the ruling king in my area these days , but I plant all three. I was told many times that Brandywines wouldn't produce well in Mississippi, and that Cherokee Purple would be a challenge. I grow them both and they always produce well and taste great. Brandywine Sudduth seems to do the best and is my favorite.

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