Down Under Disease?

[murihikukid]

Hi ..Being a new member I thought I posted my thread on this forum "Common Diseases and Pests"...Apparantly I never and have been advised to redirect to the Common Garden and Pests ... So here are my posts and photos...

Hi..I am in New Zealand and elderly and only a second year Tomato grower so my season is reverse to most members ..Unlike last year my plants have a terrible problem ...I have sought help from "experts" here in NZ but this has only made my situation worse ...
What I would like to do is post photographs of my plants and hopefully some member will tell me what is happening ..

Now I have asked for help at the nurseries in my area and actually pleaded for somebody to inspect my tomatoes as they really have to be seen...I have however taken reasonably good quality photos and hope to post them all ..
I will point out that the plants are in growing bags ....there are no insects etc and no fruit is diseased...The plants are stunted and not producing as I think they should ..no doubt due to the disease (s) in my greenhouse...I have sprayed copper etc but feel i was too late in doing this...
My growing season has been a basic disaster with my buying seeds from a NZ supplier for 17 varieties ..I hoped to find a basic sandwich tomato for next season but when my Gardeners Delight turned out to be a Yellow Fruit...My Kiev which were advertised as a large Red tomato turned out to be a very small cherry fruit..Whipper Snapper is supposed to be a bush tomato yet is clearly an indeterminate and I do not know what my Abraham Lincoln and Lisa King are ..Clearly the seeds sold to me are not labeled correctly and I am not happy with the supplier as I have spent a lot of money on the soil etc ....Every seed propagated and documented is recorded on my Computer as are the first and subsequent transplant...

I transplanted from the Propagator into a very large freezer with ceramic bulbs providing heat underneath...Later I transplanted into grower bags and then put in the greenhouse ...The plants looked great.....As time went on I became concerned with the leaves dieing and wondered if they were actually underwatered in the greenhouse resulting in the problems I now have ..
Anyway I am sure my photos will bring me some advice and answers which I will be extremely grateful for...
I have been told its malnourishment not a disease by "experts" here.....????? Its clearly a disease that apparantly starts with either a black leaf spot or the tip of the leaf turns black then the black encircles the outer of the leaf ,the leaf curls meantime other leaves on the branch get infected till the branch just drops off the main stem ......Meantime the disease is moving to another branch......
Now every plant is not affected ......Copia and Sungold have been hit bad while I have 3 Stupice plants and while two look discoloured the 3rd plant looks really healthy .....At least the fruit has not been affected badly so I can still taste them to decide if I will plant the variety in 2016-17.....
Thanks Ron NZ


ginger 2778 in Florida posted this reply ...(which I am extremely grateful for....)

I think you have 2 things going on. The interveinal chlorosis ( yellowing between the veins) is an iron deficiency most likely, but could be a magnesium deficiency. These deficiencies can be caused by overwatering, or underwatering, both starve the roots, or it could be an actual one.

The second thing wrong is fungal growth,thats your brown spots surrounded by yellow very common in a greenhouse. Remove most of the brown spotted leaves, bag them up, get them out of the garden so they aren't a source of more fungus. Don't forget to wipe down your trimming tool with alcohol or a disinfectant wipe between plants so as not to spread the disease. Your hands too.
Treat the fungus with liquid copper fungicide, going to need to do it 2 times in a 4 day period. Be very thorough above and below the leaves and down the stem to the soil line. USE THE BOTTLE DIRECTIONS FOR MIXING AT THE WEAKEST RECOMMENDED DOSE FOR TOMATOES. It will do the job. Stronger is not better, stronger will make your leafs curl. Put a small squeeze of liquid dish soap in the sprayer after mixing the copper to act as a spreader. I say after because that way filling the sprayer wont make a bunch of suds.
I hope you find this helpful.
Under watering would not be likely to be the cause of your problems, but get on a consistent watering schedule

[murihikukid]

My endeavour to post photos is blocked because of a Security Token missing whatever that is so I will keep trying...Cheers Ron

[murihikukid]

Heres another 5 photos

[murihikukid]

Here are more Photos..

[murihikukid]

Thats it ..Should be 17 photos... Thanks...

[RayR]

Have you considered it might be a soil borne pathogen like Fusarium or Verticillium. Cut open an infected stem and look for any discoloration in the center.
I hope not but it's a possibility that would account for the general symptoms.

[murihikukid]

Hi..Here is a Lisa King that clearly needs some medicine ...Would any body tell me the deficiencvy here that is making the leaves like they are....Thanks Ron..

[MissS]

I am only going to reply about "Medicine Required". Others are much better than I on disease issues/

Iron deficiency and magnesium deficiency look an awful lot alike. An easy test would be to add 1 teaspoon to a gallon of water and water with it. If it was the magnesium then you should see some greening up within a matter of days.

What are you feeding your plants? What type of soil are you using?

I also agree with Marsha that you have more than one problem going on. I am just not sure which.

[murihikukid]

MissS..I agree there is a lot going on but surprisingly some plants are basicly unaffected....Stupice and Bloody Butchers are looking pretty good BUT using last season as a guide my plants this time look very stunted in growth....I use bagged soil from a nearby gardening centre ..( Potting Mix and Compost which I mix 2 to 1 as per their directions) ...Once the plants were in the planter bags in the greenhouse I used Seasol ,a seaweed liquid extract..some powdered eggshell and powdered dried banana skins and Worm castings Liquid I was given.... I will certainly be changing the brand of soil that I buy next season.........I am now feeding a solution made by a local nursery who assure me it is really good...

Now re your last post ...Could you please clarfy *****An easy test would be to add 1 teaspoon to a gallon of water and water with it. If it was the magnesium then you should see some greening up within a matter of days.*****...
Is the teaspoon you want me to add to a gallon of water magnesian .....I do not expect miracles but just learn from this year to help me later..Thanks Ron.

[MissS]

LOL! Sure just throw in the teaspoon, but please load it with either Epsom Salt or Magnesium before dropping it in to your water.
Gosh, what great advise do I give........

Since you mention that the plants are stunted. How about planting a bean seed or two in some of your mix. If the beans fail, then I would suspect that there are some undesirable chemical residues in the compost. If that is the case, then there is nothing to do for your plants other than to rip them out, remove the soil and replant in a new medium.

Let us know if any of this works.

[murihikukid]

Thankyou ..I will try epsom salts as I understand it has magnesian in it......I have to be honest though..I do not expect too much as the tomato season is now winding down ....and I am turning my intention to "winter" and the laterals and also grafting a few Bloody Butchers and putting in my huge Refrigerator "skin" ( bought for a $2 from a scrap metal merchant after they had removed all the metal worth money from it)...It is in my front room? I have a couple of ceramic heat bulbs under the plant containers providing heat and 8 Flouro 5 foot light tubes above but am hoping to use car headlights to give me the full spectrum of light ....
I will certainly be purchasing the best Tomato Mix soil I can get ....Funny I was never interested in gardening til 2 years ago ..Thats what old age does....
If I am successful I will certainly post pictures..... Regards Ron

[b54red]

As someone who has experienced extensive fusarium problems for decades I don't think that is what you are dealing with; but whatever you are dealing with it seems quite serious.

What kind of fertilizing are you doing and what exactly are you feeding them and how often? It looks to me like some kind of imbalance that could either be too much of a good thing or not enough. You could try giving one plant a good dose of a balanced liquid fertilizer. By that I mean soak the pot to the point of good runoff out the bottom with a solution of the fertilizer at the recommended dose. As a trial you could soak the plant next to it with lots of clean water to help wash out excess minerals that are in the pot and see if that makes a difference. Two or three days later one or the other should show some improvement.

Go ahead and spray the plants with the copper spray but not at the lowest amount since if this is a disease it is fairly well established and might require at least a middling dose of the copper to control it if it can be controlled. Good luck.

Bill

[murihikukid]

Hi ...Heres what I have from a local nusery supplier..its their own mix....I will also copper spray ....as it looks like I will still get tomatoes til the frosts arrive....Then there is a new roof to put on and a built in light system to help provide more light..plus a total disinfecting before next seasons plants go in...Regards Ron

[murihikukid]

Hi...Thanks for the advice ..I can assure that it is appreciated...Now I have discovered the bags of soil and the compost I bought are just a basic mix with no additives...So I have bought a proper Commercial Tomato Mix for my lateral experiments to be planted into.

Now this is directed at MissS...My ideas of creating roots on a long stem have been knocked back after my initial lateral grew roots and is now being put in the Tomato Mix soil...Unfortunately I do not know what variety it is....

The more important laterals that were given to me have now been in water for 11 days .....and what has happened is that the stems have basicly dropped off "at for want of the proper word" I will call a knuckle....This maybe is where a branch was cut off from ....One long stem with three knuckles broke off in three pieces at the knuckle .....Upon inspection it was very soft where it broke and immediately I thought ...Why did I not take notice of what I was being told and keep the stem short to prevent this.....I am still hoping that roots will grow but I presume having long stems with "knuckles" on it would be directing the growth away from where the roots could grow....I would be very grateful for any views on this....I have attached a photo of what I have left of one lateral....
Of course I still wonder about the original laterals given to me with buds and fruit on one...I am guessing but wonder if a far younger lateral would have been better...Regards Ron
PS sorry about the Font ...I accidently touched my keyboard and the font changed and I could not get it back to what it was originally??

[MissS]

Ron, your knuckle (I like the term) is a leaf node or just node.

No, I see no evidence of any rooting going on at all. Eleven days is getting very late for these cuttings. Your cuttings are rotting away at each segment (a segment is the stem between each node). Try cutting the stem closer to the node but not at the node. Just below it. If you have any rooting hormone at this point, I would use it. I normally would not say to use it but given how old these cuttings are I don't think that you have much choice. I do not know how much light that you are giving these cuttings, but I would give them some very bright but not direct afternoon light. I would even suggest that you put these in a medium such as a light peat mix or sand so that they are not rotting in water. You could also spray or dunk them in a diluted hydrogen peroxide solution prior to planting to help kill any pathogens on them and hopefully prevent further rotting. If you choose to keep them in water, then you must change the water every day or two.

I am sorry to say that at this point I do not have much hope for your cuttings. Yes, younger cuttings would have been better but I have rooted much older ones.

The cutting that you are showing needs the whole bottom segment removed. It is showing signs of rotting with the brown at the bottom and the withered lines going up to the top. It will just cause you more problems.

Hey, most of us on this site are not so very young anymore. Who else would have the time to garden??? Who says that we can not learn new tricks?

If you can get some new starts, I would.