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Old April 3, 2017   #151
carolyn137
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Originally Posted by seaeagle View Post
So bleach being a cheap alternative to higher priced fungicides I decided to look at some research on it just in case I ever had to use any, but I couldn't find any University research.No University studies I could find other than bleach being used as a weed killer.Why?

The next logical search would be the EPA and the USDA

When mixed with organic materials (e.g., dirt), hypochlorite produces trihalomethanes , which are carcinogenic.


Because sodium hypochlorite has the potential to raise soil pH and add sodium to the soil, it should not be used as an herbicide. Additionally, an experimental application of sodium hypochlorite directly to the leaves of 8 of foliage plants caused severe necrosis, chlorosis, and leaf abscission following a single application

https://www.ams.usda.gov/sites/defau...e%203%20TR.pdf

Is it safe to use in your garden?A decision ultimately that the informed gardener has to make. I don't know








Personally I would never use bleach on plants, some use a quick bleach soak on seeds to help rid the seeds of exterior pathogens,but I never did that either.Besides only a few fungal pathogens are found on the exterior, most bacterial and viral and viroid ones are found in the endosperm of the seed.

Yes,you could go to EXTOXNET, a fabulous site and look around for more info but a quick search here at Tville I'm pretty sure would bring up similar info.. I know that I've posted links from that site many times here.

Yes,I like to watch bubbles form when bleach hits the dirt but much prefer to see my bubbles in a glass.

Carolyn
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Old April 3, 2017   #152
Dewayne mater
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Bleach treatment is a last ditch, hail Mary approach in my garden. I think it is pretty early in the grow season and plants are still tender at this stage, possibly making them more susceptible to damage from bleach. Also, if you read many of Bill's posts on this, he is primarily using it when the plants are affected by mold. Most other pathogens are treatable with a variety of things less "nuclear" than the bleach option. When you have mold, it is often far more advanced than you realize and where the mold is, the bleach will kill it and the leaves it is on. I'm not sure how it works on other problems, as I only use it to treat mold. I'm always stunned and sad to see how many more leaves are affected than I realized as they wither and die. Still, new growth is usually right around the corner and that is where most of the flowering will be.
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Old April 5, 2017   #153
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The bleach spray totally totaled my tomatoes and more. I used the exact recipe mentioned in this thread with hopes it would help with some early blight. I used a digital scale for exact amounts. 4.9 ounces for a full gallon of water with 8.25% of bleach. I applied it late evening. 24 hours later they were burnt. I'll pull them out tomorrow. That's 5 dwarfs and 2 indeterminate cherries? Dang it!!!
Using a digital scale to measure the weight will give you a different result than measuring by mass.

Ounces to Cups Conversion
The conversion factors from fluid ounces (fl oz) to cups for imperial and U.S. customary volume measurement systems are listed below. To find out how many cups in ounces, multiply by the right conversion factor or use the converter below.
1 Ounce [Fluid, US] = 0.125 (1/8) Cup [US]
1 Ounce [Fluid, UK] = 0.11365225 Cup [Metric]
Fluid ounce is an imperial and U.S. customary volume unit. Since often causes confusion, please note that it is different than the ounces which is a mass (weight) unit. The abbreviation is "fl oz".
Cup is a volume unit and used mostly in cooking to measure liquid and bulk, dry foods. There is no international size standard for it but mostly united states customary and metric cups are used. The abbreviation is "c".
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Old April 6, 2017   #154
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Ron used 1/4 cup to 1 liter of water??? 1 liter of water is 1/4 gallon. It looks like your math was off by 75%.
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Old April 6, 2017   #155
Dewayne mater
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I think he said to 1 gallon of water, not one liter.
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Old April 6, 2017   #156
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Bill I hope I have the right mix IE 1/4 cup to 1 litre of water....Cheers Ron
I think he used 1/4 cup to 1 liter of water.
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Old April 6, 2017   #157
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I see, we are talking about 2 different folks! I was talking about Aaron in Austin who said:


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The bleach spray totally totaled my tomatoes and more. I used the exact recipe mentioned in this thread with hopes it would help with some early blight. I used a digital scale for exact amounts. 4.9 ounces for a full gallon of water with 8.25% of bleach. I applied it late evening. 24 hours later they were burnt. I'll pull them out tomorrow. That's 5 dwarfs and 2 indeterminate cherries? Dang it!!!
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Old April 6, 2017   #158
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I see, we are talking about 2 different folks! I was talking about Aaron in Austin who said:


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The bleach spray totally totaled my tomatoes and more. I used the exact recipe mentioned in this thread with hopes it would help with some early blight. I used a digital scale for exact amounts. 4.9 ounces for a full gallon of water with 8.25% of bleach. I applied it late evening. 24 hours later they were burnt. I'll pull them out tomorrow. That's 5 dwarfs and 2 indeterminate cherries? Dang it!!!
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No, the above person is the one who measured by weight rather than by volume. They are NOT the same...
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Old April 6, 2017   #159
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I gave my measurements by volume only. I have no idea what differences weighing out the measurements would be.

Dewayne, there is almost no possible way that a formulation using 4.8 ounces of bleach added to a full gallon of water would burn your plants badly unless they were eaten up with disease or battered so that the plants were damaged severely before the bleach was put on them. As I have said before it is a good idea to try the mix you make on a couple of plants first and wait at least 24 hours to see if the mix is too strong or too weak. Either will result in trouble so it is best to test. I have had bottles of bleach myself that were far stronger than the label indicates and damaged a few plants as a result. Another way to damage plants is to use it in the middle of the day when it is sunny or when the plants are damaged by hail or heavy rain as the bleach can more readily enter the broken leaves.

I will try again to make this clear: I do not use the bleach spray as a last resort but rather the first resort once I see certain diseases making an appearance on my plants. I start with fungicides applied weekly but they invariably fail to one degree or another and when this happens I immediately use the bleach spray. I also use the bleach spray as a preventative spray on squash, melons and cucumbers so I can stop mildews before they get bad. Once they get bad the bleach spray will kill off so many leaves that it takes them a while to recover. The same is true of some diseases on tomatoes. If you procrastinate too long before using the bleach spray after the first symptoms occur the loss of leaves can be catastrophic.

I have not used the bleach spray yet this year as I have seen nothing but a bit of EB on a few plants and I removed those leaves. I did just buy a three gallon pack of Clorox bleach so I will be ready for the summer onslaught of diseases down here.

Bill

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Old April 6, 2017   #160
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Bill, I'm glad you mentioned the melons, squash and cucumbers. I'm in a wet environment here . I'm growing those this year and won't hesitate to break out your recipe again for everything this time. Jimbo.
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Old April 7, 2017   #161
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Bill, I'm glad you mentioned the melons, squash and cucumbers. I'm in a wet environment here . I'm growing those this year and won't hesitate to break out your recipe again for everything this time. Jimbo.
Make sure you start with the weaker concentration when you start on the melons and squash and try to get the underside of the leaves and the soil or mulch under the plants before downy or powdery mildew become visible. Once you determine the solution strength that is working for your plants then use it regularly as preventive spray. If it is a rainy or damp season I try to spray about once every week or 10 days with the bleach spray. The problem with waiting until the problem gets bad especially with squash is that all those new leaves underneath the older growth will get infected and when the badly infected squash plants are sprayed with the bleach spray most of the new growth will be killed along with the old leaves. Another trick that I have found that works is to remove the older leaves of the squash as they start to show signs of fading. I just yank them off. This allows better air flow and also removes one of the main starting locations for downy and powdery mildew.

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Old April 7, 2017   #162
Dewayne mater
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Bill

I wasn't questioning the formulation, just the 2 different posters, one of whom did talk about 5oz to the gallon and the other 5 oz to the liter - a massive different.

It probably is the case that my experience with bleach spray has been to wait too long to use it and therefore when it reacts, it is killing off the diseased leaves. Mold moves very quickly and can spread far before you find it if you aren't super diligent - especially in high pressure times of very warm and wet weather.

Maybe I need to change my mindset about last resort. What I've been doing is using daconil, then copper, then copper plus mancozeb, then bleach.
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Old April 7, 2017   #163
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I always refer people to this thread. Bill is the one who first developed this method and has the most knowledge. Thanks Bill! As he always has said, first use the bleach. Bleach kills the pathogens. Bleach only kills the pathogen and is only effective while it is wet. It does nothing to prevent re-infection. So, then apply your daconil, copper or whatever you choose as a fungicide because these are only preventatives and will not do anything to kill an existing pathogen.
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Old April 7, 2017   #164
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Thank you to bill for posting the amounts and how to use bleach spray and the why, as well as what it does exactly from MissS.

Hopefully, that will help clarify things about the bleach spray and the 5 "W's" of using it.

For me, it is a valuable tool.
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Old April 7, 2017   #165
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No, the above person is the one who measured by weight rather than by volume. They are NOT the same...
I also measured by volume, the difference was negligible at small amounts. I'm thinking the problem was the bleach I bought may have had a higher concentration then what was listed.
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