Heirlooms-Bah humbug!

MsCowpea · March 7, 2006

I linked this on another site but thought you all would get a kick out of it too. This is a recent answer given by Texas Extension Plant Answers online service.

http://www.plantanswers.com/breakout/qa3129.html

MikeInCypress · March 7, 2006

"Merced" is for the Spring??? I'll bet I can find some TAMU Extention Releases that say its good for the Fall. Aside from that there are some very good hybrids just as there are some lousy heirlooms. I grow both and have had great hybrids and great heirlooms.

I wish I knew who at TAMU wrote this drivel. I could tell them to come to my garden for a comparasion.

Michael

MsCowpea · March 7, 2006

I also wish they could see Roy and Shelly's tomatoes on their webpage. They are from Texas.

Check out their photos.

http://home.earthlink.net/~mr_chicke...oes/index.html

SelfSufficient1 · March 7, 2006

I have had better luck with hybrids than heirlooms but I really want heirlooms that I can save seeds from so I just keep on trying, lol. Nice site, I enjoyed reading about their tomatoes.

Suze · March 7, 2006

Grrrr. Makes me wonder who has been answering these questions and making comments on behalf of that entity lately* -- wondering if there has been a recent shift in personnel.

*the 'better save seed from the soon to be discontinued hybrids' suggestion also comes to mind.

For the most part, TAMU has a track record of providing fairly good information on tomatoes.

**nctomatoman** · March 7, 2006

That response is not surprising. I think that many of us who are garden obsessed (and in particular obsessed about a niche, such as heirloom tomatoes, hot peppers, etc) underestimate how much knowledge we accumulate - and the flip side is how superficial the knowledge of generalists is.

I've been living in Raleigh for 13 years, given countless garden talks, know the "garden inner circle" (actually more of a closed circle that I am allowed to peek in at now and then) - and some of the inaccuracies that end up in our Saturday garden section either make one laugh or cry!

SelfSufficient1 · March 7, 2006

I only learned there was even a such thing as heirlooms and hybrids when I got internet 5 years ago. I like to think I have learned a lot but since coming on this forum I have found out how much I really don't know.

But it's a good thing, I think

.

MsCowpea · March 7, 2006

[/quote]I will doubt if the Florida Extension Service has tested any of those heirloom varieties — we haven't here in Texas because they are so unproductive and unattractive.[/quote]

Actually the Univ. of Florida has tested heirlooms for possible commercial use.

http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/HS174

The article ends with the following statement:

"UF's Cooperative Extension Service is performing research to discover the best ways for Floridians to grow and use these delicious and fascinatingly varied fruits."

Unfortunately his response is read by many, many people and taken as gospel because it comes from a respected source.

Suze · March 7, 2006

Good point, MCP. And ya know what, I've seen references on the TAMU sites before regarding OP varieties, so I simply don't know what this person is basing their information on.

jerseyjohn61 · March 8, 2006

That opening nonsense was simply a professional
"cop-out". It was based on either inexperienced
ignorance or commercial protectivism. The
commercial seed and produce industry may feel
a threat from the emergence of heirloom interest.
Or he could simply be regurgitating the same crap
he has been taught....JJ61

jdwhitaker · March 10, 2006

I think it was Carolyn who said that extesion service folks simply regard tomatoes as a means to an end--and this was not necessarily a negative thing. When A&M does variety trials they are measuring things like pounds per acre of marketable yield--very important for market growers, and the varieties that produce best are usually also good for the average gardener with a couple of tomato plants.

I dare say that most tomatovillains are not the average tomato grower. We love strange shapes and colors of tomatoes, while others only want round and red. We'll glady accept a slight decrease in yield for a variety with a good story behind it. Many of the things we desire in a tomato can not be measured scientifically--flavor being an obvious example.

I think A&M does a great job at what they are trying to do, it simply applies to a tomato producer, not a tomato fanatic. I do wish they would make separate variety recommendations for home gardeners, who could benefit from saving seed and growing indeterminate plants, even if those plants produced 12 lbs instead of 19.

They do recommend Large Red Cherry and Porter for small-fruited tomatoes, which are both OP.

Jason

March 7, 2006	#1
MsCowpea Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: S. FLorida / Zone 10 Posts: 369	Heirlooms-Bah humbug! I linked this on another site but thought you all would get a kick out of it too. This is a recent answer given by Texas Extension Plant Answers online service. http://www.plantanswers.com/breakout/qa3129.html __________________ "When we kill off the natural enemies of a pest we inherit their work." Carl Huffaker

March 7, 2006	#3
MsCowpea Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: S. FLorida / Zone 10 Posts: 369	I also wish they could see Roy and Shelly's tomatoes on their webpage. They are from Texas. Check out their photos. http://home.earthlink.net/~mr_chicke...oes/index.html __________________ "When we kill off the natural enemies of a pest we inherit their work." Carl Huffaker

March 7, 2006	#6
nctomatoman Tomatoville® Moderator Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Hendersonville, NC zone 7 Posts: 10,385	That response is not surprising. I think that many of us who are garden obsessed (and in particular obsessed about a niche, such as heirloom tomatoes, hot peppers, etc) underestimate how much knowledge we accumulate - and the flip side is how superficial the knowledge of generalists is. I've been living in Raleigh for 13 years, given countless garden talks, know the "garden inner circle" (actually more of a closed circle that I am allowed to peek in at now and then) - and some of the inaccuracies that end up in our Saturday garden section either make one laugh or cry! __________________ Craig

March 7, 2006	#8
MsCowpea Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: S. FLorida / Zone 10 Posts: 369	[/quote]I will doubt if the Florida Extension Service has tested any of those heirloom varieties — we haven't here in Texas because they are so unproductive and unattractive.[/quote] Actually the Univ. of Florida has tested heirlooms for possible commercial use. http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/HS174 The article ends with the following statement: "UF's Cooperative Extension Service is performing research to discover the best ways for Floridians to grow and use these delicious and fascinatingly varied fruits." Unfortunately his response is read by many, many people and taken as gospel because it comes from a respected source. __________________ "When we kill off the natural enemies of a pest we inherit their work." Carl Huffaker

March 7, 2006	#2
MikeInCypress Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Cypress, TX Posts: 963	"Merced" is for the Spring??? I'll bet I can find some TAMU Extention Releases that say its good for the Fall. Aside from that there are some very good hybrids just as there are some lousy heirlooms. I grow both and have had great hybrids and great heirlooms. I wish I knew who at TAMU wrote this drivel. I could tell them to come to my garden for a comparasion. Michael

March 7, 2006	#4
SelfSufficient1 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Georgia, USA Posts: 188	I have had better luck with hybrids than heirlooms but I really want heirlooms that I can save seeds from so I just keep on trying, lol. Nice site, I enjoyed reading about their tomatoes.

March 7, 2006	#5
Suze Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 3,027	Grrrr. Makes me wonder who has been answering these questions and making comments on behalf of that entity lately* -- wondering if there has been a recent shift in personnel. *the 'better save seed from the soon to be discontinued hybrids' suggestion also comes to mind. For the most part, TAMU has a track record of providing fairly good information on tomatoes.

March 8, 2006	#10
jerseyjohn61 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Central New Jersey Z/6 Posts: 554	That opening nonsense was simply a professional "cop-out". It was based on either inexperienced ignorance or commercial protectivism. The commercial seed and produce industry may feel a threat from the emergence of heirloom interest. Or he could simply be regurgitating the same crap he has been taught....JJ61

March 10, 2006	#11
jdwhitaker Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Andrews, Texas Posts: 104	I think it was Carolyn who said that extesion service folks simply regard tomatoes as a means to an end--and this was not necessarily a negative thing. When A&M does variety trials they are measuring things like pounds per acre of marketable yield--very important for market growers, and the varieties that produce best are usually also good for the average gardener with a couple of tomato plants. I dare say that most tomatovillains are not the average tomato grower. We love strange shapes and colors of tomatoes, while others only want round and red. We'll glady accept a slight decrease in yield for a variety with a good story behind it. Many of the things we desire in a tomato can not be measured scientifically--flavor being an obvious example. I think A&M does a great job at what they are trying to do, it simply applies to a tomato producer, not a tomato fanatic. I do wish they would make separate variety recommendations for home gardeners, who could benefit from saving seed and growing indeterminate plants, even if those plants produced 12 lbs instead of 19. They do recommend Large Red Cherry and Porter for small-fruited tomatoes, which are both OP. Jason