Russian Bogatyr - indet. but not a beefsteak???

[Tania]

This is how my Russian Bogatyr's baby fruits look like - they don't look like beefsteak baby fruits to me...



I thought they are supposed to be beefsteaks, no?
My plants are all looking identical, fruits too, and they are indeterminate.

Browsing the 2006 Yearbook, I found very different descriptions - i.e.,

IL LO N - 80 days, indet., regular leaf with a high yield of 5-10 oz red plum fruit, very good flavor, from NY MA C 05

NY KI N 75 days, indet., regular leaf, 7 oz, red fruit, excellent flavor, good yield, from NY MA C 05

NY MA C 75-80 days, indet., regular foliage, huge yield of very large beefsteak type fruits, 1-2 lbs, superb taste, the plants just keep bearing strongly until frost, from Andrey Baranovski of Minsk, Belarus, via Earl Cadenhead of OH, possibly bred in Russia but not known for sure, could be a family heirloom as well

WI MI B 75-80 days, indet., regular leaf, 1+ lb red beefsteak fruit, very good to excellent flavor, high yields, from NY MA C 05 via Andrey Baranovski, Minsk, Belarus

OR KA A 95 days, indet. vines with clusters of 1 lb good quality fruits, from NY MA C


Also, from browing some Russian websites, some Russian vendors are listing Russian Bogatyr as F1...

I am not sure what to make out of this yet, but by all means, if you have any pictures of Russian Bogatyr's fruit or plants, please post away here, so we all can compare!

[carolyn137]

Tania,

Since all the SSE persons you listed got their seeds from me it seems obvious that the seeds I sent out, both to SSE members and perhaps also to some GW members, were crossed.

My seeds were original seeds ( Andrey had sent to Earl) sent to me by Earl and the first time I grew them I think I had two plants and both had large red beefsteak fruits.

The second time I grew them, which I think was last year, I grew just one in a pot, b'c I no longer could do the large plantings I used to and wanted more seed. Those fruits were smaller but I still attribute that to the pots having all compost, thanks to my brother, the weather being blistering hot and no way to water them.

Andrey was not sure of the background of this variety which is why I wrote what I did in the blurb you cut and pasted here from the SSE Yearbook.

So two of the four folks you listed who got seeds from me did get the large red beefsteaks that I did initially and two didn't.

Somehow if it were an F1 hybrid I wouldn't have expected that, but who knows.

I have no pictures but it shouldn't be that difficult to judge what folks get/got, just from words.

[PNW_D]

Russian Bogatyr
Here’s a picture. These did not taste nearly as good as they look, and they were also my last to ripen in 2005.

http://<br /> <a href="http://xs.to...[/img]</a>

[carolyn137]

D,

Those are only about two inch fruits and are not what I get when I get the large beefsteaks.

I guess someone who saves pure seed from the large beefsteak one is going to have to come to the rescue. unless this really is an F1 hybrid.

But then with all those SSE folks growing it out and probably just 1-2 plants per person, that does seem a bit far fetched to me based on other F1 hybrids I've tried to dehybridize.

However Tania is saying that she sees info that it is an F1 hybrid on Russian sites. if so, Andrey, where are you and what do you think at this point?

[lumierefrere]

Those Bogatyrs of D's look more like mine from the determinate Bogatyrs I grew last year and they were quite late maturing, well into August. Yes the taste was so unremarkable I didn't bother with them this year.

Barb

[Andrey_BY]

As I've already told to Carolyn and some of others there are two versions of Russian Bogatyr so far. I've sent to Earl indeterminate version in 2004 when I've no idea about existence of determinate version with the same name. I discovered determinate version of RB in 2005 and had sent it to Carolyn and some other gardeners in 2005-2006.

Both are CVs distributed by two different Russian seed companies. I've seen one Russian Bogatyr F1, but it was introduced in 2006 (much later than first two) by our Belarussian seed company APD which usually only pack varieous seeds obtained from Russia, Poland, Netherlands and other countries and have made many mistakes in names and OP/F1 identification.

Here is an APD's package f Russian Bogatyr F1. It's description is the same as for determinate version. So it's their mistake with OP/F1 for sure.

http://oz.by/garden/more130125.html

So for indeterminate version you will get 100-200 g fruits (not beefsteaks at all) and for indeterminate vesrion you should expect very vigorous plants (1.8-2 m) and 300-500 g fruits (up to 800 g) :wink:

[carolyn137]

and for indeterminate vesrion you should expect very vigorous plants (1.8-2 m) and 300-500 g fruits (up to 800 g)

And that's exactly what I did get with the indet version that you sent to Earl and he sent to me.

Yes, you sent me the det version but I haven't yet grown it. I have this unexplained bias against det varieties which has no basis other than my personal preference.

So again, I'll say that it looks like some folks who got the indet version from me received crossed seeds such that some got the larger beefsteaks and some didn't.

Thanks Andrey for reviewing the Russian Bogatry situation for us.

[Andrey_BY]

Always welcome, Carolyn!

Actually this determinate version is quite robust as well and reminds me Moldovan variety Persey with 5-6 fruits in every truss and rather good yeild.

Originally Posted by carolyn137

Yes, you sent me the det version but I haven't yet grown it. I have this unexplained bias against det varieties which has no basis other than my personal preference.

So again, I'll say that it looks like some folks who got the indet version from me received crossed seeds such that some got the larger beefsteaks and some didn't.

Thanks Andrey for reviewing the Russian Bogatry situation for us.

[michael johnson]

Andrey- looking at your link for russian tomatoes in your post, on the other listed tomatoes and photos etc, there is a very usefull looking tomato right at the top-with four and a half stars against it, obviously top rated by them, -it looks like a cherry tomato for growing in pots etc.

I would love to know what it is called in english, as I cant read a word or pronounce any of the info given in russian, as it look s a very productive variety-worth keeping in mind for future use. can you help with the translation, it would be much appreciated.

[Andrey_BY]

Michael - this is Pinocchio a small fruited tomato varety for pots. Kind of Balcony Wonder. I've got it as well, but I doubt it worth of growing. The taste is not so good.

If you are looking for some good Russian hybrids like Needed Size F1 I will try to help you in autumn :wink:

[michael johnson]

Thanks Andrey, I thought because it had four and a half stars against it and none of the others had, it must be good, but obviously I was wrong- you just cant beat a bit of local knowledge on these matters-despite the hype in the catalogues, I just cant bear tomatoes that dont taste good or are very bland.

We have a very well known tomato in england that often earns it rave reviews since 1936 , called (moneymaker) in the war time the ministry of agriculture wanted all growers to stop growing other varieties and concentrate only on moneymaker as it was supposed to be the wonder tomato- early, easy to grow anywhere-in any kind of soil,sets all tomatoes up the stem etc, etc, -it may well do all of those things -but I personaly think it is one of the most tasteless tomatoes ever and very bland in every respect, my father and uncle used to rave about them and grew nothing else but those for years but whats the point in growing an utterly reliable crop year after year if the taste is rubbish, I personaly havn't grown them for years because of this.

[Andrey_BY]

Michael - We know Moneymaker here very well. According to our local standards it is midearly, but the taste is not so perfect - you are right.