Fertilizer

[lakelady]

I can see how hard it would be on a large scale to be composting, and growing organically for market. My little gardens are a few raised beds and it is a a lot of work. Just making compost is a full time job for me practically. I have access to tons of big oak leaves and still have a few piles in the yard that I never got around to shredding before winter. And it sure does take a lot of compost for those few raised beds. It is lovely however, to dig in those beds and see that beautiful black dirt which results from all the hard work.

Last summer I did take one bed of tomatoes and use an inorganic fertilizer and compared to the other plants. The inorganic was almost wiped out by those ugly army worms, but for some reason, they left the other two beds alone . While not an official study of any kind , it did have me wondering why the regular fertilized plants were so attractive to them.

I do like the fact that composting allows me to have such a great medium to plant in that I really don't have to worry about fertilizing much at all. A little seaweed and fish emulsion and I'm done.

[rnewste]

I'm with Linda, (and another friend over in the Opal, VA. area) who have given up on the OMRI listed "new" Tomato-tone. The "old" 4-7-10 non-organic Tomato-tone is still my personal gold standard, and I'll be trialing 4 non-organic brands to see if I can replicate the old Tomato-tone's performance. I post results later in the Season.

Raybo

[Sun City Linda]

I think I am putting about a cup and a half of Lily Miller Ulta green blend 10-10-10 (Lowes for ten bucks) in my EBs for tomatoes this year. I had good production with that and with 2 cups Earthbox 7-7-7 blend in my fall crop before the big freeze got everything that the late heat wave left standing.

What are you trialing Ray?

[clkeiper]

Originally Posted by lakelady

Last summer I did take one bed of tomatoes and use an inorganic fertilizer and compared to the other plants. The inorganic was almost wiped out by those ugly army worms, but for some reason, they left the other two beds alone . While not an official study of any kind , it did have me wondering why the regular fertilized plants were so attractive to them.

I read a study several years ago on corn, I don't remember if it was field corn or sweet corn, but it did give the same results. Organic crops were more resistant to army corn worms. the synthetic fertilized crops had much more damage. I don't remember the exact scientific reason, but it had something to do with the rapid soft growth from the nitrogen. Maybe there was more sugar in the plant than in the organic "slower" crop.

[rnewste]

Linda,

I will be using the "old" Tomato-tone (4-7-10) as my reference standard, then trialing products made by Fertilome, E. B. Stone, High Yield Garden Fertilizer, and Lilly Miller. I will start a new photo thread when I have taken pictures of these products. Hopefully, I find something with results similar to the old Tomato-tone.

Raybo

[Sun City Linda]

Excellent, thanks Ray. We tend to forget that the "old" tomatotone was not a fully organic product. This is one of the reasons I am hopeful for my Lily Miller blend. Earthbox synthetic is also a blend. It seems to me that for SWC growers in long growing seasons, this may be a good way to go.

[rnewste]

Linda,

As I recall, Sprtsguy (Damon) uses the Lilly Miller 10-10-10 with excellent results in his SWCs.

Raybo

[Rockporter]

Originally Posted by rnewste

Linda,

As I recall, Sprtsguy (Damon) uses the Lilly Miller 10-10-10 with excellent results in his SWCs.

Raybo

Ditto, so do I.

[babice]

Good thread. Question- does anyone also give your container toms a fish emulsion treat now and then in addition to your fert routine?

[elight]

To echo Babice, I'd also like to know how and when others use liquid fertilizers such as a fish emulsion to supplement the regular time-release fertilizer. I live in the Northeast, and everyone here is raving about a fertilizer called Neptune's Organic, so I'd love to give it a try if appropriate.

[PaigeJ]

I give my container plants liquid ferts once a week to supplement the slow release granular ferts I give every four weeks. So far so good.

[Urbanfarmer]

Originally Posted by lakelady

Last summer I did take one bed of tomatoes and use an inorganic fertilizer and compared to the other plants. The inorganic was almost wiped out by those ugly army worms, but for some reason, they left the other two beds alone . While not an official study of any kind , it did have me wondering why the regular fertilized plants were so attractive to them.

We have found a interesting irony that isn't too hard to deal with. We grow mostly hydroponically, so we get perfectly healthy, prolific plants. The irony is that the growth is so lush, with lots of young, tender shoots, that this offers up plants that, at times, are irresistable to bugs. What bug wouldn't want to eat tender shoots?! It's kind of like......do you prefer young chard or old chard?

This might also explain why commercial greenhouse growers can experience stunning outbreaks of whiteflies and/or aphids if they let those critters get in. In a controlled environment like a greenhouse, the bad bugs go wild on all the tender shoots. (we know all about this....been there, done that)

When we have a problem we use pyrethrins.

[clkeiper]

Originally Posted by babice

Good thread. Question- does anyone also give your container toms a fish emulsion treat now and then in addition to your fert routine?

We used it last year and I couldn't see any improvement over the stuff that wasn't watered with it. We did use it in drip irrigation...big mistake. It clogs up the holes in the emitter tape and it won't drip like it is supposed to. I am not using it this year except to use up what I have and get the container out of the greenhouse.

[Redbaron]

Originally Posted by lakelady

Last summer I did take one bed of tomatoes and use an inorganic fertilizer and compared to the other plants. The inorganic was almost wiped out by those ugly army worms, but for some reason, they left the other two beds alone . While not an official study of any kind , it did have me wondering why the regular fertilized plants were so attractive to them.

Very common observation. Most people believe it is the rapid growth of lush vegetation, but organic methods can also get that same lush growth when everything is right, and without the bugs. So that leads me to think it is a combination of lush growth and a lack of a proper symbiotic microbiology in the soil.

[RayR]

I think all your observations are well founded, I've seen it myself.
An overfertilized plant may look perfectly healthy, but it is really in a state of stress. The bugs always go after the most vulnerable.

Why and How Insects and Mites Feed on Your Plants and Flowers

Plants that are overfertilized, especially with nitrogen-based fertilizers, produce succulent growth, increasing susceptibility to plant-feeding insects and mites. The higher levels of amino acids, which are the primary food source used by insects and mites, can increase their reproductive ability. In addition, plants that receive excessive levels of fertilizer may have thinner leaf cuticles, which are easier for insects and mites to penetrate with their mouthparts.

I agree with Redbaron that the soil microbes play a part since it has been proven that they can influence the plant defense mechanisms including calling in the predators to take out the bad guys.