same ole question....

[KCMO_Don]

Thanks again to all that responded with great answers to my last VERY simlar question, but thsi is a "perlite" question.....

I am in Kansas city, MO a VERY clay based zone 5, and I have been in my home for about 2 years. I have been FEVERISHLY amending my soil and in places that I have focused it is an earthworm Mecca with a light fluffy texture, and sweet aroma! J
I have since built one LONG raised bed for 20 different varieties of heirloom tomato.
Here is my “issue” …. Last fall after laying down several sheets of wet newspaper, I filled these beds with shredded leaves, old horse manure, finished compost, grass clippings, and some good topsoil. I was diligent about turning the material in these beds about every 7-10 days all winter (very mild winter). I suddenly have a TON of earthworms (and worm egg cases), and cannot find any real sign of the individual ingredients that filled the beds. As I turned the beds I dug approx. 12 inches into the ground below in order to gain more room for roots. I think by incorporating this clay soil into the raised bed material I have made it far to dense and compaction prone. This mix can REALLY hold the water!!! And it is pretty “heavy” when wet. I haven’t had a soil sample done and in the name of my budget I probably won’t.
Do you all think that adding a LOT of perlite will fix this issue?
Do you think it will be a problem?
The beds are 12” high (plus 12” below) and 18” wide, by very long! Imagine a 40 foot trough.
Any input would be GREATLY appreciated as the Toms will be going in about 4 weeks from now!!
Thanks a ton
Don

[sliphorn]

I think gypsum will do a better job of loosening the clay. Of course you could always add both.

[spudleafwillie]

Don,
My call would be gypsum (to break up the clay) and peat moss (to improve the drainage) and possibly lime to make the pH as close to 7. You might want to add about 200-300 lbs of sand to also help the drainage too. Perlite is kind of pricey here in NM, about 25 bucks a 6 cu ft bag.

Spud

[mresseguie]

Hello, Don.

This is my first reply on this message board, and I hope I don't step on anyone's toes.

I live in Oregon's Willamette Valley where clay is everywhere. It sounds as though we are next door neighbors! All of my veggie beds and many of my flower beds are raised. My veggie beds are the deepest-approx 16". I dug down too, but I didn't bring the clay up into the higher levels. I amended compost into the clay to loosen it up.

When I made my beds, I added sand, perlite, and vermiculite to lighten the soil. I did not add gypsum because I have heard from too many sources that it does not work as advertised.

As long as your clumps of clay are small, they won't interfere with normal root development. They will aid in water retention (a plus), and giving nutrients (a plus).

If your soil is compost plus some clay, you ought to have great soil already.

Is there an extension office near you? The U of M will be able to direct you to the appropriate source. Look for the master gardener rep. Most counties in Oregon have an office. (I'm a BCMG--Benton County Master Gardener) I imagine most counties in MO will too.

Compost already has a balanced Ph, so you shouldn't need to add lime. Four weeks isn't enough time for lime to work anyway. You may want to add oyster shell for calcium though. You also don't need peat moss since you already have tons of compost. (This is where I may have stepped on toes........sorry if I did.)

Please bear in mind my information and knowledge is specific to this area. Your local master gardener will have all pertinent information at his/her fingertips there. Good luck and have fun!!!

Links:

http://extension.missouri.edu/mg/

http://extension.missouri.edu/cmregion/mg/

http://extension.missouri.edu/cmregi...questions.html

I hope this helps.

Best regards,

Michael in Oregon
Zone 8

P.S. If you speak with a Master Gardener, tell him I said, "Hi!"

[KCMO_Don]

Thank you all very much!!
I don't have "clumps" of clay (thank goodness) just soil that seems to REALLY love water

[giardiniere]

You probably got some heavy rain up there over the weekend too, didn't you? Hopefully you missed out on the tornados though. I know it got pretty rough on the Kansas side, just wasn't sure about your area.

[KCMO_Don]

BARELY MISSED ME!
Got a bit of hail and some wind that's all!

[Adenn1]

Don:

I have wonderful gray clay and did the same thing you did last year...turned my bed and brought up a good amount of existing clay. I got called away and did not get back to the beds for a few days...came back to find dried, hardened clumps of clay.

I eneded up breaking them up as much as possible with a fork and shovel. I had about six weeks before the toms were to be planted in this bed. I covered the bed with free leaf compost, grass clippings and coffee grounds...and added kitchen scrapes as they became available. When I planted, I took the material from the planting hole and broke it up as best as I could...I added some leaf compost and some peat moss. My plants did wonderfully.

I think in your case your worms will be your best friend...they will help with aerating the soil. Kitchen scrapes and coffee grounds will help as well as adding any other organic material.

[KCMO_Don]

Thanks Adenn!!
Good to hear a success story from someone in the same boat.
My soil is actually clump free and pretty crumbly. It just holds a ton of water.
Thanks again!!

[travis]

Don,

With me often it's a matter of economics, and perlite can be very expensive. I did get a 50-pound bag of 50/50 vermiculite/perlite at the local farm cooperative for 12 bucks last week, but then you can get a 50-pound bag of oil absorb made from diotomacious earth for five bucks, and I found it really spaces out my potting mix and absorbs water like a sponge.

Since I've been amending with diotomateous earth oil absorb product, when I water my seedlings, the water runs down through the containers much more rapidly that when it was just peat, perlite, and vermiculite. The diotomaceous earth also swells up and seems to retain water at least as well as vermiculite for less than half the cost.

Another product that works well for me is the baked clay oil absorb and it comes in 50-pound bags for about 3.50. It doesn't retain water like vermiculite or diotomaceous earth, but it's excellent at spacing out the growing medium to provide better aeriation and drainage.

Fire clay is even better since it will not break down since it has been fired in a kiln. Fire clay is a product sold to potters to augment pottery clay. It's also used to produce bricks that can stand up to high heat like in fireplaces and kilns. You should be able to buy fire clay wherever you buy pottery clay or from a brickmaker.

Also, crushed brick works well for the same purpose ... spacing out growing media and improving drainage.

PV