Indigo Rose vs Indigo Apple and Others

[Salsacharley]

I opened this thread to separate the issue of differentiating Indigo Rose from Indigo Apple as well as throw in some more for fun.

I've grown many blue varieties beginning with Indigo Rose four years ago. I was awed by the amazing beauty of it. I was very disappointed in its flavor and I concur that it is insipid. I won't grow it again.

I've grown Indigo Apple for three years and I will continue to grow it because it is also awesomely beautiful and it has great flavor. I sell it out a the market every time I have it to offer. I have found it to be a productive and tough plant. The fruits do vary from 3 oz to 6 oz for me and some even have mild ribbing.

Here is a list of other blue fruits I will always grow because they look amazing and they taste good. I sell them at market and I have established a niche for Amazing Tomatoes (that's my market name).

Blue Beauty (Wild Boar, competes with any pink/red beefsteak for flavor)
J & L Midnight Select (J&L Gardens)
Blue Gold (WBF)
Wagoner Blue Green (Tradewinds)
Dark Tiger (J&L)
Black Shadow (J&L)
Shadow Boxing (Tom Wagner)
Amethyst Jewel (WBF)
Muddy Waters (Tom Wagner)
Perfect Storm (Tom Wagner)
Primary Colors (Tom Wagner)
Ozark Sunrise
Ozark Sunset
Stripes of Yore

I grew many others that I probably won't repeat because frankly, they get to appear redundant even with separate unique traits.

I will continue to grow a few blue cherry varieties, too.

I sell at market and I have developed many repeat customers who love the flavors and appearance of these tomatoes as well as other more classic heirlooms and OP's.

Charley

[carolyn137]

(I opened this thread to separate the issue of differentiating Indigo Rose from Indigo Apple as well as throw in some more for fun.)

Charley, I thought we already did that with several giving links to Tania's pages for both, with other sources cited and many comments that said just b'c two varieties look the same to some folks it doesn't mean they are the same. And I know I gave several examples .

So, being curious, what more do you want to know about those two varieties that hasn't already been posted, whether in the major antho thread or otherwise.

Mark McCaslin ( Frogleaps Farm) ,who made the original initial cross for one of them as initially posted by Travis yesterday and just confirmed this AM by Mark, I'm sure could speak to this issue better than anyone else if indeed there still are questions.

Carolyn

[Salsacharley]

I opened this thread to separate the issue of Indigo Rose vs Indigo Apple to stop the hijacking of the Blue Danger thread. I don't want to know anything more. I am just expressing my experience with Blue tomatoes.

[AlittleSalt]

Charley, this past spring was my first time to ever see a blue tomato much less grow one. We grew several varieties and found one that out produced the others. The taste was okay, and we want to grow it again (Helsing ★★★★★★★★ Blue). But I am hoping to find a better tasting blue tomato. After reading this thread, I am adding Indigo Apple to my tomato wish list. I have found a few larger size blue varieties to grow next spring. All the people I grow tomatoes for seem to love cherry and smaller size tomatoes (<4oz.)

I figure if Indigo Apple does well for you in NM - they should do well here in TX neighbor

[Gardeneer]

Originally Posted by Salsacharley

I opened this thread to separate the issue of Indigo Rose vs Indigo Apple to stop the hijacking of the Blue Danger thread. I don't want to know anything more. I am just expressing my experience with Blue tomatoes.

Thanks. Information never hurts.
I felt a bit guilty for bringing up the subject but then it was not completely off the topic.
So here we are with a brand new thread off the mill.
Here are a couple of pictures that I took minutes ago. Since then the IR is all gone. hehe. As you have said the taste is not that great But I like its ornamental features.
If I recall correctly, the Indigo Apple that I tasted some time ago had more of a redish meat and also tasted better.

[travis]

Originally Posted by Salsacharley

I am just expressing my experience with Blue tomatoes.

With regard to your own experience with anthocyanin expressing tomatoes, can you answer a few questions I have:

Several of the lines you mention as having grown were released in the early stages of segregation and recombination.

How many plants of each blue stained line do you generally grow each year?

Which of the lines of blue stained tomatoes have you found that segregated and recombined with different flesh colors, foliage shapes, degrees of furry foliage, fruit sizes, fruit shapes, stripe patterns, anthocyanin coverage, other specific traits, etc. WITHIN the same named lines?

Have you found that the anthocyanin traits transfer to other non-anthocyanin type tomatoes via accidental pollen transfer frequently in your saved seed batches?

Conversely, have you found non-anthocyanin variety traits transferred into your anthocyanin stained tomato lines accidentally (natural cross pollination)?

[Salsacharley]

Ah ha! These are good questions.

I grew 2 of the following varieties and they appear to be stable and consistent with prior years and original descriptions: Indigo Apple, J&L Midnight Select, Blue Beauty.

I grew 2 of the following with anomalies: Amethyst Jewel...one plant came out with red-orange fruit and no antho. It had good taste and was productive but definitely not Amethyst Jewel.

Primary Colors - I actually grew 3. 2 were consistent to the standard (in my opinion) but one came out like Fuzzy Wuzzy with yellow fruit and no antho.

Shadow Boxing - I grew 1 regular RL plant that came out with elongated striped fruit with nice antho. I grew a dwarf Shadow Boxing that was dwarf with rugose leaves and globe-like fruit looking like the regular Shadow Boxing fruit.

I only grew 1 plant each of the others and they came out as their descriptions presented.

As a side note I grew the following blues that didn't come out blue at all...
Blue Tears, Bosque Blue, Painted Blue. They were all pink with no anthocyanin.
Also an Amethyst Cream came out pink but did have anthocyanin.

I haven't seen any anthocyanin trait transfers to non-anthos. This is the first year I've grown many of these and I used seed acquired from the original source for most. The Blue Tears was from the MMMM swap. Amethyst Cream was from Marsha.

I have never seen non-anthocyanin traits transferred to anthocyanin varieties, but most of my seed is from original sources. Next year I plan on planting half from saved seed so I might find quite a bit more variance.

Originally Posted by travis

With regard to your own experience with anthocyanin expressing tomatoes, can you answer a few questions I have:

Several of the lines you mention as having grown were released in the early stages of segregation and recombination.

How many plants of each blue stained line do you generally grow each year?

Which of the lines of blue stained tomatoes have you found that segregated and recombined with different flesh colors, foliage shapes, degrees of furry foliage, fruit sizes, fruit shapes, stripe patterns, anthocyanin coverage, other specific traits, etc. WITHIN the same named lines?

Have you found that the anthocyanin traits transfer to other non-anthocyanin type tomatoes via accidental pollen transfer frequently in your saved seed batches?

Conversely, have you found non-anthocyanin variety traits transferred into your anthocyanin stained tomato lines accidentally (natural cross pollination)?

[Fred Hempel]

What is this about blue tomatoes? Why are they sad? (asked by Emily Litella)

[Fred Hempel]

Charley,

Have you tried Indigo Cherry Drops?

[Salsacharley]

I have not tried Indigo Cherry Drops. I have tried Blue Berries, Bing Cherry, Fahrenheit Blues, Helsing ★★★★★★★★ Blues, Baby Blue, Blue Tears, Clackamas Blueberry. Based on my own experiences with these I'm only going to proceed with Bing Cherry and Helsing ★★★★★★★★ Blues. I'm going to reduce my "blue pursuit" because it only takes a couple of blue varieties of each color (red/pink, yellow, green, orange) to meet the needs of my business. In general, non-blue tomatoes have much more taste potential, and since the taste effect is the primary driver, the eye effect doesn't need too many blues to create the "amazing" effect.

[Worth1]

I tried the blues one year and it was a disaster.
The whole garden was a disaster but the blue tomatoes were the biggest ones of all.
I may never give them another chance.
I dont remember which one it was but the few I did get were nasty.

Worth

[Fred Hempel]

I think you might find that Indigo Cherry Drops knocks out all other blue cherries. I give it a hearty recommendation. I was just wondering how it compared to your best blue cherry tomatoes.

Originally Posted by Salsacharley

I have not tried Indigo Cherry Drops. I have tried Blue Berries, Bing Cherry, Fahrenheit Blues, Helsing ★★★★★★★★ Blues, Baby Blue, Blue Tears, Clackamas Blueberry. Based on my own experiences with these I'm only going to proceed with Bing Cherry and Helsing ★★★★★★★★ Blues. I'm going to reduce my "blue pursuit" because it only takes a couple of blue varieties of each color (red/pink, yellow, green, orange) to meet the needs of my business. In general, non-blue tomatoes have much more taste potential, and since the taste effect is the primary driver, the eye effect doesn't need too many blues to create the "amazing" effect.

[Fred Hempel]

Charley, I will add Indigo Cherry Drops to the package of seed that I owe you.

[Salsacharley]

Thanks Fred!
I'll give em a go on your recommendation.

[Fred Hempel]

Trust me. I never thought I'd recommend a blue tomato. But, sometimes it is nice to be wrong.