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Old April 27, 2015   #46
monty71466
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Originally Posted by jmsieglaff View Post
Thanks for the update Monty! Certainly seems a lot of the genetics at play are not simply inherited. If the F1 is a wild ride what will the F2 bring? Can't wait!
I surely haven't ruled out environmental elements as well. For example, it's still cool here especially at night. I know the squash does better once it warms more. I'm also trimming them to stop most branching. While they aren't producing a fruit at every node, it's notable that each branching stem I've not gotten to trim seems to produce a fruit at the first node. There aren't enough male flowers right now either!

I've got about 20 Lemon/Zephyr F2 growing. Wow, all over the board. One is similar to the F1 parent. Hope it tastes just as good. Many are shaped like overweight straightneck squash. Many are wimpy growers. An interesting one of those is mottled green and acorn shaped (not ribbed, but actually acorn shaped). Tasting the fruit is critical to it all. It'd be nice if the prettiest or coolest plant also produced the tastiest fruit. I haven't ever tasted the Tatume, but I can compare Justin's to the Lemon which I love. I suspect, being a bigger fruit, it won't be as dense, maybe more like a Zucchini or straightneck in texture. Having fun with it all.
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Old May 1, 2015   #47
monty71466
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Default Lemon / Tatume Update from Justin's Seed

Notes: First two pics are Lemon for comparison, but not the true parent of this line.

Plant 1 (3d & 4th pics) - Oldest fruit, some faint speckling, and sort of dull. May be due to age some. Don't think it's going to get much bigger. Leaves are smallest of the 4. Limited vining and smaller plant.

Plant 2 (5th & 6th pics) - Most aggressive viner. Plant wants to be here! Lined fruit with very faint speckles. I can see the Tatume in this one pretty good. Fruit has decent sheen. Leaves are large and have an occasional variegation.

Plant 3 (7th & 8th pics) - Second most aggressive viner and pretty close to Plant 2. Fruit is yellow, green, good sheen, and speckled. Leaves are medium-large, a bit darker, and is variegated. The leaves remind me a lot of zucchini types.

Plant 4 (9th & 10th pics) - Leaves are the most Lemon-like, but a little bigger. Maybe a slightly longer point. It vines a little more than the Lemon. Beautiful round fruit with good sheen. While the fruit is showing some extremely faint speckling, it doesn't appear more so than the Lemon parent.

Other: More male blooms coming on. My Lemon plant isn't a great example of the Lemon. Seems stunted a little. I think if you planted this seed, you'd get tons of variation in the F1s as witnessed here. As a matter of fact, I believe you'll find your ideal plant in the F1s if you plant out 50 or better seed. I'm going to plant the remaining seed out in the garden in the next 2 weeks myself.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Parent - Lemon Leaf.JPG (327.7 KB, 136 views)
File Type: jpg Parent - Lemon Squash.JPG (143.0 KB, 134 views)
File Type: jpg 1 - LT Plant 1 Leaf.JPG (237.4 KB, 136 views)
File Type: jpg 1 - LT Plant 1 Squash.JPG (115.0 KB, 136 views)
File Type: jpg 2 - LT Plant 2 Leaf.JPG (269.5 KB, 138 views)
File Type: jpg 2 - LT Plant 2 Squash.JPG (127.1 KB, 134 views)
File Type: jpg 3 - LT PLant 3 Leaf.JPG (263.7 KB, 133 views)
File Type: jpg 3 - LT Plant 3 Squash.JPG (146.4 KB, 134 views)
File Type: jpg 4 - LT Plant 4 Leaf.JPG (215.7 KB, 136 views)
File Type: jpg 4 - LT Plant 4 Squash.JPG (96.7 KB, 129 views)

Last edited by monty71466; May 1, 2015 at 12:48 PM.
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Old May 1, 2015   #48
jmsieglaff
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Wonderful pictures Monty, thanks for sharing! I am truly amazed at the diversity in the F1. Perhaps a knowledgeable plant genetics expert can enlighten us with some theories, but the variability in habit, leaf shape/size, fruit color, etc. just wow. I won't be growing anywhere close to 50 plants, but this definitely makes me put some last minute changes into my 2015 plans. I will grow only 1 Tatume and 1 Lemon for comparisons and the rest will be the F1s. It will be interesting to see flavor differences too.

In picture 8, if you only showed me the bottom of the fruit, I'd guess it was a baby Tatume. If you only showed me the top, I'd guess it was a baby Lemon. I'm excited and will be on the look out in the F1, trying to select for vining habit early in the plant life cycle.
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Old May 1, 2015   #49
monty71466
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Default Lemon/Zephyr F2s I'm Keeping My Eye On

Here are 3 curious LZs that are interesting. One a colorful zucchini-type shaped like a fat straight neck. One looks more like a lemon than a lemon and it has great white coloration mixed with yellow. The last is a potential copy of it's parent that tasted so wonderful. Love this stuff.
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File Type: jpg LZ - F2 Plant 1.jpg (198.2 KB, 126 views)
File Type: jpg LZ - F2 Plant 3.jpg (151.8 KB, 126 views)
File Type: jpg LZ - F2 Plant 2.jpg (147.1 KB, 125 views)
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Old May 1, 2015   #50
jmsieglaff
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Monty your posts have given me the itch! Some very interesting results with your cross. Are they Lemon-like or even more bush like in habit? I usually plant my squash seeds around May 15. But the coolest night over the next 7 will be in the mid 40s with a lot of 50s and 70s during the day. So I said what the hell and sowed today. Nothing to lose but a few seeds, I can always resow if the weather goes down the tubes. But my raised beds warm quickly and are warm enough, and with warmer temps coming I sowed sqaush the earliest I ever have. I can cover because I don't grow much because the garden isn't huge.
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Old May 2, 2015   #51
monty71466
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Originally Posted by jmsieglaff View Post
Monty your posts have given me the itch! Some very interesting results with your cross. Are they Lemon-like or even more bush like in habit? I usually plant my squash seeds around May 15. But the coolest night over the next 7 will be in the mid 40s with a lot of 50s and 70s during the day. So I said what the hell and sowed today. Nothing to lose but a few seeds, I can always resow if the weather goes down the tubes. But my raised beds warm quickly and are warm enough, and with warmer temps coming I sowed sqaush the earliest I ever have. I can cover because I don't grow much because the garden isn't huge.
Vine habits are every variation of the two from tight bush to slight vining. They are also still sluggish due to cool nights I believe.
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Old May 5, 2015   #52
monty71466
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Default Lemon-Tatume Taste Test

So, I cooked up about 1/3 of each squash in the same way--a little butter and a little salt. Here are the results along with some pictures and one of my hybrid F2s to compare with. Keep in mind that for plain eating, I'm not super fond of zucchini prepared this way so:

1. Bland somewhat zucchini-like with an off taste. I didn't want to finish this one.
2. Bland zucchini taste with a slight off taste.
3. Very happy to report this one tasted a good bit like a traditional yellow somewhat rich and sweet (ish). Not quite as good as a Lemon, but pretty good.
4. Not tasted.
5. Sort of like a yellow, but not zucchini. Something like I haven't tasted, but fairly good. Might be more Tatume tasting?? Haven't tasted Tatume. Maybe a good winter squash?
6. Poor quality yellow squash taste.

My Hybrid F2 - Not a great example of a yellow. Not as dense or nearly as good as Lemon. It's parent exceeded Lemon.

Notes: I have 3 buckets each with two plants in them. 3 is the runaway favorite of mine with 5 being next. 3 is a fast, aggressive grower with bigger fruit. 1 and 2 aren't worth the space. 6 really isn't either. Here are the pics.
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File Type: jpg IMG_0286.JPG (273.8 KB, 111 views)
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Old May 8, 2015   #53
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Yet another great set of pictures and like your flavor report Monty! Thanks again. Looks like you've got a couple ones to follow that agree with your tastebuds. Have your nights warmed up?
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Old May 9, 2015   #54
monty71466
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Yet another great set of pictures and like your flavor report Monty! Thanks again. Looks like you've got a couple ones to follow that agree with your tastebuds. Have your nights warmed up?
Justin,

Yes, 58-65 for lows over last week. Got 2 more each of #3 and#5 to try.

Monty
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Old May 25, 2015   #55
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Justin. I went ahead and planted four of the F1 seeds you sent me on May 7 and all of them grew. They seem quite vigorous.
Let me know what you want me to note about them as they growout. I was gonna wait till fall because the heat/humidity will be here soon enough, but maybe they have some tolerance?
Anyway, here they are; A, B, C and D:
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1432594884.495805.jpgImageUploadedByTapatalk1432594905.271884.jpgImageUploadedByTapatalk1432594928.339745.jpgImageUploadedByTapatalk1432594941.022736.jpg
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Old May 25, 2015   #56
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Monty how are those squash tasting?

Steve, great to see you've got them in the ground in Florida! They look healthy! I'd be curious if you see the variance that Monty has seen in the F1. I'm also curious to how they do with your summer climate and disease pressures. Tatume (the mother is from Texas/Mexico, so it certainly handles heat, but not sure about humidity).

I've got my seeds in the ground. I sowed an early batch and then filled in with a later sowing. I'm going to be selecting plants in each spot trying to select for vining habit (more like Tatume). I can't wait for these to get going, especially with the variability Monty has seen in the F1.
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File Type: jpg May252015_23sm.jpg (702.4 KB, 75 views)
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Old May 25, 2015   #57
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They are growing fast under ideal conditions at the moment. I think I found a spot with few nematodes. If I can get them to climb I might be able to keep them going when the weather turns more Jungle-like in the next month or so. I will try to keep you posted on any variability I see or anything else that might be of interest.
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Old May 25, 2015   #58
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Great! Thanks again. Obviously if something stands out in production and/or flavor department that would be worth knowing as well. It will be interesting to see if multiple people end up following their own lines how similar or different the endpoints end up.
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Old May 26, 2015   #59
monty71466
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Dang, had 3 huge paragraphs typed and TV logged me out and lost it all. Quick summary. Taste is about what I said above. Only have 2 plants left. Kept #3 and #5, but will get rid of #5 soon. Things are taking over. Harvest at baseball size or smaller. I had leftover squash for first time yesterday. LTs mixed with my hybrid, but mostly LTs. The squash was "normal" (pan fried with butter, salt, and pepper) the day it was prepared, but super-sweet the next day after microwaved. I'm hoping this will translate into either a great grilled and carmalized squash potentially or a really good winter squash. My #3 makes a baby at almost every node, braches like mad with a baby yellow bb when branch is less than 2". Incredible amount of girls, but not enough male flowers. The weak ones I initially said were my fault. They picked up after I corrected the watering issue. I have 8 or 10 plants in the garden between both of you guys' squash in size. I expect a carpet of LTs with tons of yellow balls everywhere. Seriously, you guys may have planted too close! Best wishes. I'm staying tuned.
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Old May 26, 2015   #60
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Monty, Is it hot yet? And if so, how are they handling it?
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