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Old May 23, 2016   #1
MrSalvage
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Default Do i have enough pressure for BIY drip line or tape system?

Hello, I have been studying the different type's irrigation. It seems as drip tape would be the most cost effective. However I have some concerns that my '"Well" will be able to handle the tape.

Then there is the fact that i want to plant out as much of my property as possible in the years to come. Yep it will take years as i am only 1 old man. lol

Anyway i been gathering as much information as I can. So I can determine what is best for this crazy piece of property that i live on.

So do i have enough pressure for to run a drip line or tape system? Will I be able to build a setup that can fulfill my needs into the future?

I am going to start adding some pictures to help with all the info / data needed to make a decent guess.

If i need more info by the end of my posts please tell me what that might be.

I am still learning all the lingo that goes with this hobby. So please be easy on a rookie.

As always thanks in advance for your any of your time.
Bill
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Old May 23, 2016   #2
MrSalvage
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Here are some measurements...

The red line to the left feeds water to the mobile home.

The red line on the right just gives some distance to understand better.

As you can see I have a bit of a valley that runs through the property. err
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Last edited by MrSalvage; May 23, 2016 at 05:45 PM. Reason: spelling
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Old May 23, 2016   #3
MrSalvage
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Here is my brand new submersible well pump. I have forgot exactly how far down that pump is. I want to say 25 to 30 ft. I can go and pop the well cover and get a measurement if needed.
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Old May 23, 2016   #4
MrSalvage
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This is the line that runs from the well to the mobile home. I tried to get 1 picture of what the line said on it. However it just wasn't in the cards. So here is three... Sorry

1" 160# PSI @ 73.4 Fahrenheit Orangeburg Poly - Xtra Pe3408
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Last edited by MrSalvage; May 23, 2016 at 05:43 PM. Reason: Added data to the post...
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Old May 23, 2016   #5
MrSalvage
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This is the model number on my pressure switch Model #: FSG2J21CP. I have it set real close to 30 PSI

The Square D by Schneider Electric pressure switch works with jet pumps, submersible pumps and reciprocating pumps and the 30 - 50 PSI pressure switch features a 1/4-in pressure connection
Suitable for jet pumps, submersible pumps and reciprocating pumps
30 - 50 PSI
Standard action contacts
Maximum pressure 220 PSIg
Captive cover screw
Single and 3 phase rated
Can be mounted in any position
Conduit plug included

http://www.lowes.com/pd_67599-296-FS...ductId=3134937
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Old May 23, 2016   #6
MrSalvage
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I wanna say that I put a (Utilitech 36-Gallon Vertical Pressure Tank) in the top of the well. I can't seem to find the pictures of it anywhere. So i will need to go up and pop the lid to be sure which one.

Here is some info from the Lowe's website as well.

36-Gallon Vertical Pressure Tank

Composite base assures 100% paint coverage for added exterior corrosion resistance
Revolutionary parabolic diaphragm design eliminates internal rubbing of the tank wall, the primary cause of diaphragm failure
Exterior powder coat paint for long life and anti-corrosion, certified to autmotive ASTM Standards
Powder coated interior shell protects against corrosion, assures long trouble free life
The primary purpose of this tank is to protect your pump
NSF 61G and 372 No-Lead Certified
Larger than industry standard tanks providing more drawdown for longer pump life
Please be certain you are selecting the right tank for the job
You can only undersize a well tank you cannot oversize it

http://www.lowes.com/ProductDisplay?...llow&cId=PDIO1
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Old May 23, 2016   #7
whistech
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One of the first things to know is how many gallons per minute you have coming out at the hose bib at the mobile home or wherever you plan on starting the drip tape. Once we know that, then we can figure out how many feet of drip tape you can water with at any one time. I suspect you will be able to water a lot of rows at one time.
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Old May 23, 2016   #8
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Arlie, I completely agree.

I have 1,200' of 3/4" PVC from the meter to the house. It easily takes care of a 45x45' garden's drip irrigation.
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Old May 23, 2016   #9
Worth1
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Lets say all things being equal on your up hill down hill thing.
I need elevation.
But if you are going down hill for 188 feet on a certain slope and going up 100 feet on the same degree of angle or grade.
You will gain around 34 PSI alone just from the fact that water head pressure is 4.3 pounds for every 10 feet of elevation.
You have 188 going down and 100 going up.
The 100 feet down and up equalizes and you gain the pressure of 88 feet worth of head.
That is if the elevations are as I said but they aren't.
What is the difference in elevation from one point to the other?

Worth
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Old May 24, 2016   #10
MrSalvage
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My water line is 202 ft down and 63 ft up Worth1. So then based on what you said I would have 141 ft of head. So does that give me an extra 60 PSI?

(The water line is only under that "left red line" I made on that picture. There is nothing under the "right" side line Worth. Only a measurement sir.)

As far as elevation the grade or angle of both hills are about the same. But as you can see in the picture the up hill is rather short @ 63 ft. This is where the water goes into the M/H

---

Now this is where it gets confusing to me. Do I need to figure out GPM at the well or at the house? I do not have a hose bib up at the well. I do have one right at the back of the mobile home.

Thank you Arlie, Salt & Worth...
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Old May 24, 2016   #11
MrSalvage
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I added a lil more info in this picture about where my water line is.
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Old May 24, 2016   #12
Worth1
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Getting late I will draw a description of what I am talking about tomorrow.
As with elevation and pressure.
One way to do it is to get a hose run it from the source and to the garden with water in it.
Put a gauge at the garden end with no pressure from the tap.
Put another gauge at the source.
This will show you the pressure gain and the difference in elevation.
Think water tower.
A 100 foot full water tower will have about 43 PSI at the bottom.
This is why there is a tank at the top and a pipe going down.
If the town is another 100 feet in elevation below that you will have 86 PSI.
If the town is 100 feet above the bottom of the tower you will have 0 PSI.
If the pipe going to the town goes up 50 feet and then back down 50 feet.
The 50 foot mark up will lose 21.5 psi but will gain it back on the next down hill side.
This is due to the siphon effect.
This same effect is how you measuer pressure in the ocean at depth.
If you go down 100 feet you will have a lot of pressure on you like 59 psi.

Some place on this forum I have all of this drawn out.
Worth
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Old May 24, 2016   #13
cwavec
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Sorry, MrSalvage but I think you are misdescribing almost everything. Look at your waterline
from the well to the home. You say 202' downhill and then 63' uphill but I do not believe for
one second that these numbers are the vertical difference. The picture just does not look like
a 202' change in elevation. Then look at your "uphill" portion. The line you draw for that part,
although it may not be fully representative, is not even equal to the height of the home, which
surely is not more than about twenty feet.

You need to understand that water pressure in a closed system depends on the vertical
distance and that the horizontal distances really have nothing to do with it until you start
running water through those pipes and hoses. I suggest you go and get yourself an
inexpensive laser level and measure those vertical differences, in steps if you have to.
Then you will have a much better idea of what you need to do.
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Old May 24, 2016   #14
MrSalvage
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cwavec View Post
Sorry, MrSalvage but I think you are misdescribing almost everything. Look at your waterline
from the well to the home. You say 202' downhill and then 63' uphill but I do not believe for
one second that these numbers are the vertical difference. The picture just does not look like
a 202' change in elevation. Then look at your "uphill" portion. The line you draw for that part,
although it may not be fully representative, is not even equal to the height of the home, which
surely is not more than about twenty feet.

You need to understand that water pressure in a closed system depends on the vertical
distance and that the horizontal distances really have nothing to do with it until you start
running water through those pipes and hoses. I suggest you go and get yourself an
inexpensive laser level and measure those vertical differences, in steps if you have to.
Then you will have a much better idea of what you need to do.
Hey how are you doing? This drawing I made only represents the amount of distance between points on the ground. I did this with a 100 ft tape measure. So this drawing is in no way a factual representation of elevation or vertical distance in any way shape or form man. However a picture is worth a thousand words & that's why I posted it.

I think I do have a pocket laser that I can place on the top of the Well. Then get a measurement of where the laser hits the Mobile Home. If i had to guess it looks like the laser would hit right at the top of the back window. Then I could measure how many feet it is to the ground & or hose bib. I wonder if that kind of measurement would help?

Thanks for your post and the idea!

Now I have my 5 gallon bucket and hose set up to measure GPM at the garden. So I will have that data a little later today.

Thanks
Bill
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Old May 24, 2016   #15
Worth1
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Bill I think you will find the faucet to be around 10 feet lower than the top of the well.
That it a wild guess but I bet I am close.
You more than likely have around a 2 to 3 foot rise in elevation from the faucet to the garden.
These elevations aren't even worth considering only the fact you arent loosing pressure and gaining a wee bit.
Also unless you start putting out a ton of water with a huge drip system you dont need to worry too much about flow.
The gallons per minute and pressure is important.

Look at the price difference between 3/4 and 1 inch pipe.
It isn't enough to amount to a hill of beans in your plans but can play a huge role in water delivery.
Even if you have 3/4 coming from the well and you want to go that 100 feet to the garden use 1 inch it can make a difference.
Here is a myth about smaller pipe.
Smaller pipe does not increase pressure it increases velocity.
Velocity in pipe is your enemy.
What it does is decrease pressure while it is flowing due to friction loss.
The only reason they use it is to save money.
And example of this is my place.
I have about 100 feet or so of 3/4 inch copper line coming from my meter at 50 PSI static water pressure.
My flow rate at the faucet is 10 gallons a minute.
My flow rate at the meter is 23 gallons per minute.
That 3/4 line killed 13 gallons per minute of water delivery due to friction loss.
When I put my sprinkler system in I came directly from the 3/4 line at the meter and jumped up to 1 1/2 pipe from that at the valves I put in one inch pipe.
At no place other than the heads themselves do I have anything smaller than 1 inch.
This in effect killed any friction loss and stopped water hammer.

You might not need that 1 inch now for drip but as you said you want to expand, you might not be able to with 3/4.
I over size wire and pipe for this reason.
Drip isn't too much of a big deal you can get away with a lot.
Buy or find yourself two gauges and use them to calculate your system.
Put one at the water source and one at the end of the line at the garden.
The first reading will be supply pressure and the latter will be residual pressure.
This will tell you exactly how much drip line you can get away with.

Lets say you have 50 PSI at the supply and you put in 100 feet of line and turn it on.
The supply gauge drops to 30 psi and you can get away with 10 PSI on the drip line.
This will tell you that you can put in about 200 more feet of drip line.
The gauge at the other end will give you your friction loss reading.
If it is 25 psi it tells you you have around 5 PSI of friction loss.
This reading will get bigger the closer you put it to the supply side.
When you get to that target point of 10 psi on any zone it is time to start another zone.
No fancy math just two gauges and some common sense.

With your set up now you dont need to worry too much.

Worth
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