Need quick ans., pls. OK to use just 2 pond bskts?

[arlinek]

I've got everything together now to make 2-3 DIY earthboxes. At H. Depot I got these black, square plant basket containers, made for a pond. They are about 9" square, 6" high. Can I just use two of these for the "support" of the screen (I'm actually cutting out the bottom of a second 18 gal. container to use as the screen/separator, which will also support it around the perimeter)? I mean to use the two baskets as the support and no other PVC, except for the fill tube. If that's okay, should I put the soil MIX in BOTH baskets, in addition to laying it on top, of course, or just fill in ONE basket with the mix and leave the other empty?

[arlinek]

Hmmm, in re-reading various instructions I have, I see that normally just one large basket or 4" PVC pipe is normally used for packing and wicking the water up. So, since I want to use two as the supports and the wicking, I guess I'll just pack one basket, right? And the other one I'll just put in next to it side-by-side and leave the open top of the basket closest to the underneath of the aerator screen? So both of the baskets' bottoms (which are also slotted) will be sitting on the floor of the outer 18 gal. container. But, that will make the filled basket not centered, but closer to one side than the other. Does that matter, or MUST the wick/basket be in the center of the tub?

[arlinek]

Well, sorry - another notation from me. I just fitted the two baskets side-by-side inside the 18 gal. container and it's a VERY tight fit because they are so large, although they could be squeezed together. They are 9.75" wide, so one per container should be fine as far as support goes. But, now my question is: is having the basket THAT big a problem, instead of the normal 4" wide PVC pipe or sand pail? IS 9.75" TOO wide and/or could it cause "too much" wicking? Don't want to mess up my first trials and waste my $$ doing it wrong. These baskets are 6" tall so that I will have a large resoirvoir of water, decreasing the frequent need to refill.

[Earl]

I just went through the same frustration of finding the best material to use in the bottom of the EBs that would allow optimum water storage and also serve to be sturdy and support the separator from the soil. After tossing away a lot of cash on stuff I tried septic tank drain line and it works great. Been using the 7 and 5 inch pipe with water drain slots in it. If you try it, make sure it has the drain slots as some of it doesn't. Just use a jig saw to cut it to length. About $12 a section for 7", $5 for 5", but you can get enough for 4 or more ebs of 30" by 16".

[arlinek]

Thanks, Earl. I did see your previous mention of this, but here's my concern: I've read several references about the lack of safety in using any black plastic like that when it will be in contact with water that eventually enters the tomatoes or other veggies being grown - it's the plasticizers that are of concern, potentially causing cancer, etc. As of right now, though it's also being questioned,white PVC is still considered safe. So, I'm hesitant to use the black plastic pipe for that purpose. I was at H. Depot today to get the 4" white PVC pipe and guess what: THEY don't have that. They only have the white 4" with the black plastic lining, another potential safety issue for me. The mgr. confirmed that it's not recommended to use any of the black plastic stuff if it's ultimately for human consumption purposes. NOW, I have to find some pipe company that sells this 4" PVC. This has now become so complicated!! In addition, neither H. Depot nor Lowes carry the right kind of Soil Mix now. It's all 50% composted "forest mat'l" and then moss and a smidgen of vermeculite. Lots of probs now to find all the right stuff! Now I'm wondering about the safety of even using those black pond baskets!! (That's why I was searching for the white pipe.)

[Earl]

With all the EPA rules and Regs. in the industry and all the consumer groups involved in water pollution I don't think anyone would make any pipe that would leach any bad stuff into the water table and take a chance on being sued for umpteen gazillion dollars.

[arlinek]

Well, just to clarify, Earl. I'm only referring to the BLACK plastic pipe as I was informed that only the white pipe is considered and made for human water consumption. But, I only know a little about what I've read and/or heard. I did have to special-order the 4" white pipe with the pre-drilled holes in it and got it the next day, so I returned the black plastic baskets and used a 6" piece of the white pipe for the traditional support and wick.

[zeldog]

Plain old terra cotta flower pots work just fine in my homemade eboxes. The hole in the bottom lets in plenty of water. Let's face it, you don't need gallons per minute of water transfer, more like pints per day. And the pots are water permeable anyway. They are not secured with wires or anything, but once you add the potting mix they won't move. Just be sure to cut the holes in the screen a little smaller than the tops of the pots.

[squibT]

I'm using black nursery pots for supporting the screen and also for the wicking chamber. Also golf club shaft protectors made of black plastic for the filler tube and air tube. I did a little research on black plastic toxicity and could only come up with a laymans recomendation to try to get recyclable black plastic...the stuff is sometimes numbered but I forget the numbering scheme right now. The golf club sleeves seem to be made of the proper stuff but not certain. As far as the black pots...who knows...thing is, we buy plants for eating in these black containers all the time...no warning on them. We nuke plastic lunch containers in the micorwave all the time (not me personally) which is a big no no....we drink water and pop out of plastic bottles all the time....they are supposed to be safe...It has been shown that sun exposure and time will leach out carcinogens from these everyday items....no warning on them either. I would like to know the "real" health risks, if any at all, making the EB's with back plastic if anyone knows for sure...not interested in opinions so much as fact. PVC is a no no...or so say a few on these forums. Copper tube would work if you could find a cheap source and some large enough. Terra cotta pots is genius...

squibt

[PeteD]

I would not worry about using the black plastic for plants or EB construction. The HD person meant not to use that pipe for water supply. You may get some phthalates or other compounds leaching from plastic that may create some off-flavors in the water, which is why you don't want to drink it. The danger from letting your plants "drink" this water is non-existent in my educated opinion. The water concentrations are going to be so low, you would have to have some incredible bioaccumulation to have anything measurable in the fruit.

Also, think about the plastic totes that people use for home-made EBs. Those are going to have the same types of compounds in them.

[vegomatic]

And I'm tempted to toss in the question of what clays were the pots fired from? I can point you to clays a few miles from here with radioactive salts in it, for example. Are any sort of "health" standards applied to garden pots? Should there be? How far do you take your concerns?

Face it, we are confronted with all sorts of ill-defined or unknown hazards every day. Looking at it historically, I guess at some point they decided drinking from lead goblets was a no-no. A lot of people "tested" early types of canned food by giving their lives to science, as it were.

I sure agree that plastic exhudes some nasty stuff. Something that sits in constant moisture, like the bottom of a plastic growing tub, with more plastic in it as fixtures, might not be all that appealing.

What's the alternatives? Stainless steel? Glass? Many layers of large leaves? Large containers of unpreserved wood? Hmm, now are we talking about molds and other natural toxicants?

I'm of the age that most of my foodstuffs have seen various commercial wrappings. I guess I'm still around to recall them over the years. It's all so safe nowadays, I can hardly open the blasted bag of chips to indulge my craving for saturated fats!

It's good to be safe, as sad and fatal mistakes have proven, but sometimes I think we fret too much. As a friend of mine once told me, "it's hard to think of all the health nuts in hospital beds, dying of nothing."

-Ed