A personlly successful white fly control method

FreyaFL · November 23, 2012

I have had a TERRIBLE white fly problem lately. Massive quantities of the buggers that nothing (purchased...labeled for organic, though) seems to have worked with. Three weeks ago I started something new and regular and am now virtually white fly free.

First, I make a neem oil spray. In a mason jar put 24 ozs warm water and add a bit less than 1/4 tsp dish soap, I used Green Works, shake it WELL. Now add 3/4 tsp neem oil. Shake it WELL again. Put this in a spray bottle and spray well all signs of white flies on all your plants that you can see. Make certain to shake the bottle often to keep the oil mixed! (This can take some time and you may have to make more mix. Really be sure you've covered those nasties.) The next day, take a spray bottle filled with warm water (nothing else.) Look over all the plants and spray any white flies you now see. There are often some. If you find you've missed an infested leaf/area, use the neem spray (you may have to make fresh. Fresh made, with warm water, is best.)

The first time I did this, 4 days later there were virtually no white flies at all. In a couple places, I saw little black dots all over a leaf back, and removed them, just in case. One week later, repeat the spraying. This past week, my third week out, I found barely any white flies, but those I did, I sprayed the heck out of again!

I have had ZERO luck with the commercially available neem sprays, btw, so I wouldn't waste your money on them (since I already did). Or any of the insecticidal soap sprays (same reason). Or even that one thing I can't believe I used but I was desperate and then it didn't work so I tossed it before I caved and tried again. I really hate white flies.

Oh, an interesting side note, because I have powdery mildew on my zucchini and the poor things looked like they weren't going to make it, I figured it wouldn't hurt to give them a quick misting of the neem spray (I was a bit spray crazy at that moment). Two days later almost all signs of the PM was gone and big, deep green leaves appears.

kilroyscarnival · November 23, 2012

Nodding and making a handwritten note. Sounds good, Freya. The local woman whose blog I started reading, and whose stuff I have bought at a nearby farmer's market, said she only uses neem oil for pest and fungus control when someone asked her.

Is all neem oil the same or are there good and bad brands/extractions? I'll ask that generally, but what brand did you buy?

FreyaFL · November 23, 2012

I have a bottle of Theraneem Organics: Neem Oil for the Garden. White bottle. I bought it at a health food store.

Thanks for the info on hearing it can be used as a fungicide. I will now spray several other plants that have traces of PM that I didn't want to kill while in my spraying craze.

ginger2778 · November 23, 2012

Here's the neem I use, I order 2 at a time. It's pretty reasonable and you have to use it often. :http://www.gardensafe.com/products-a...ncentrate.aspx
Neem is supposed to be anti bacterial, antifungal, and insecticidal to soft bodied insects such as whiteflies, and they can never develop resistance to it like they can with a pesticide. Mix with a little soap as a wetting agent about a teaspoon for a 2 gallon sprayer, and I use 3 TBSP per gallon of the neem oil.Shake often while spraying, and only spray early AM or late afternoon to avoid frying the plant's leaves in the bright sun.
It is totally organic, and it has something in it that inhibits growth of new whiteflies.
Good stuff. I can't remember for sure but I think the shipping was free for the 2.
-Marsha

kilroyscarnival · November 23, 2012

I think that is the brand I saw at Lowe's, Marsha. Which is good to know. Freya, the only neem oil I see via health food stores is a 1 ounce bottle for topical healthcare use. Is that what you use in your formula?

dice · November 24, 2012

You can find pure neem oil with no additives of any kind
packaged for the soap, shampoo, etc industries. Simply mix
it with soap (organic dish soap, Castille soap, Murphy's Oil Soap,
etc) to give it something to bind to in a spray (not water
soluble). It needs to be at 80F or above to keep the fats
in it dissolved in the other parts of neem oil. At lower temperatures
you can see the chunky stuff coagulating in it. (I simply put it
in a container of hot water in a sink to dissolve all of the fats
and shake it before measuring some out to make a spray.)

For some uses on plants, it works well. Somehow it interferes
with the metabolism of many insects, which gives it its insect
repellent properties. Forget all of the stuff about medicating
with it. It is a nice skin and hair tonic, but it does not kill tough
bacteria like staph or strep, and it does not kill tinea (athlete's
foot, ringworm, etc).

It clearly works well on white flies, used as described in this thread.
http://www.essentialwholesale.com/Neem-Oil

FreyaFL · November 24, 2012

Great additional info! I think I might buy one of those misting sprayers to provide a wider range of coverage as I had to refill my 24 oz bottle 3 times just for my relatively small number of plants. (I definitely coverage well, though.)

DON'T buy the expensive, 1 oz, stuff at the healthfood store. What I have is made for garden use and in a 16 oz bottle (100% neem oil, too). I'm sure the brands listed by the others is just as good.

I've a question though! Is it okay to use this spray if it'll get on things like tomatoes, or zucchini, or other soon-to-be consumed produce?

kurt · November 24, 2012

http://www.horticulturesource.com/ac...sprayers-s101/ Keep in mind most of the feeding,breeding and egg laying goes on underneath the mater leaves.Got me 360 sprayers for that purpose.

dice · November 24, 2012

Quote:

Is it okay to use this spray if it'll get on things like tomatoes, or zucchini, or other soon-to-be consumed produce?

The soap that the neem oil is bound to will allow it to wash off
easily. (You can buy neem extracts that are edible, azidarachtin,
or neem leaf capsules, but I do not know of anyone that eats
the pressed oil directly, and you would not want to eat the soap,
either.) As far as I know, it is not absorbed by the plant that you
spray it on.

FreyaFL · November 25, 2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by kurt

http://www.horticulturesource.com/ac...sprayers-s101/ Keep in mind most of the feeding,breeding and egg laying goes on underneath the mater leaves.Got me 360 sprayers for that purpose.

I have a problem with using the hand pumping spray bottles for any length of time (I've nerve damage that causes a weakness in my hands for certain repetitive movements), so I would like to get one that is uses a pump air pressure sprayer. Reading the reviews it sounds like these are very hit and miss as far as good or bad. (Anyone with a "good" one they'd recommend? 2 quart to 1 gallon size is what I'm thinking.) And, yeah, they love the undersides, don't they?

I have another dozen plants nearly ready to plant out and REALLY need something that sprays underneath without my lifting every single branch like I've been doing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dice

The soap that the neem oil is bound to will allow it to wash off easily. (You can buy neem extracts that are edible, azidarachtin, or neem leaf capsules, but I do not know of anyone that eats the pressed oil directly, and you would not want to eat the soap, either.) As far as I know, it is not absorbed by the plant that you spray it on.

Thanks! I was hoping this would be the case. (I don't spray my greens as the white flies haven't seemed to bother them, but I hit the green tomatoes even though I try not to.)

kurt · November 25, 2012

At amazon if you buy $25.00 worth and sign up for the 30 day free Prime trial you get free shipping (2 days).Friend sent link.She got the Safer organic spray cheap with the sprayer same time. SOLO DIRECTIONAL SPRAYER W/ EXTENDA WAND [Item # 708590]

FreyaFL · November 25, 2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by kurt

At amazon if you buy $25.00 worth and sign up for the 30 day free Prime trial you get free shipping (2 days).Friend sent link.She got the Safer organic spray cheap with the sprayer same time. SOLO DIRECTIONAL SPRAYER W/ EXTENDA WAND [Item # 708590]

Thanks for the referral on the sprayer! (Though, the Safer spray is one I tried and it worked as well as plain water which does work somewhat. I'll hope she has better results.)

kurt · November 25, 2012

She had good success with the Safer Bio Neem concentrate.I guess they have different products.We use ladybugs/minute pirate bugs for control.

Tracydr · November 25, 2012

Glad to read this, as I just noticed a bunch of whiteflies on flowers and eggplants. Will give this a try.

FreyaFL · November 26, 2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by kurt

...We use ladybugs/minute pirate bugs for control.

Most of the ones I'm battling are inside my screened pool area. There are ones outside it, but they seem to be under control atm from predator bugs and plant death (my sweet potatoes...they totally attacked these. Fortunately, sweet potatoes will survive an apocalypse, so I trust they'll recover. LOL)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tracydr

Glad to read this, as I just noticed a bunch of whiteflies on flowers and eggplants. Will give this a try.

Good luck! Remember to not be delicate here. Spray, spray, spray! (Whiteflies seem to prefer my peppers, next after that the eggplants.) Oh, just be careful about timing of spraying. It should be done when the sun won't then burn them. (Evening? Morning?) I guess this is the advice given when doing any kind of foliar spraying, however.

November 23, 2012	#1
FreyaFL Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: SW FL Posts: 152	A personlly successful white fly control method I have had a TERRIBLE white fly problem lately. Massive quantities of the buggers that nothing (purchased...labeled for organic, though) seems to have worked with. Three weeks ago I started something new and regular and am now virtually white fly free. First, I make a neem oil spray. In a mason jar put 24 ozs warm water and add a bit less than 1/4 tsp dish soap, I used Green Works, shake it WELL. Now add 3/4 tsp neem oil. Shake it WELL again. Put this in a spray bottle and spray well all signs of white flies on all your plants that you can see. Make certain to shake the bottle often to keep the oil mixed! (This can take some time and you may have to make more mix. Really be sure you've covered those nasties.) The next day, take a spray bottle filled with warm water (nothing else.) Look over all the plants and spray any white flies you now see. There are often some. If you find you've missed an infested leaf/area, use the neem spray (you may have to make fresh. Fresh made, with warm water, is best.) The first time I did this, 4 days later there were virtually no white flies at all. In a couple places, I saw little black dots all over a leaf back, and removed them, just in case. One week later, repeat the spraying. This past week, my third week out, I found barely any white flies, but those I did, I sprayed the heck out of again! I have had ZERO luck with the commercially available neem sprays, btw, so I wouldn't waste your money on them (since I already did). Or any of the insecticidal soap sprays (same reason). Or even that one thing I can't believe I used but I was desperate and then it didn't work so I tossed it before I caved and tried again. I really hate white flies. Oh, an interesting side note, because I have powdery mildew on my zucchini and the poor things looked like they weren't going to make it, I figured it wouldn't hurt to give them a quick misting of the neem spray (I was a bit spray crazy at that moment). Two days later almost all signs of the PM was gone and big, deep green leaves appears.

November 24, 2012	#6
dice Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: PNW Posts: 4,743	You can find pure neem oil with no additives of any kind packaged for the soap, shampoo, etc industries. Simply mix it with soap (organic dish soap, Castille soap, Murphy's Oil Soap, etc) to give it something to bind to in a spray (not water soluble). It needs to be at 80F or above to keep the fats in it dissolved in the other parts of neem oil. At lower temperatures you can see the chunky stuff coagulating in it. (I simply put it in a container of hot water in a sink to dissolve all of the fats and shake it before measuring some out to make a spray.) For some uses on plants, it works well. Somehow it interferes with the metabolism of many insects, which gives it its insect repellent properties. Forget all of the stuff about medicating with it. It is a nice skin and hair tonic, but it does not kill tough bacteria like staph or strep, and it does not kill tinea (athlete's foot, ringworm, etc). It clearly works well on white flies, used as described in this thread. http://www.essentialwholesale.com/Neem-Oil __________________ -- alias Last edited by dice; November 24, 2012 at 02:53 AM. Reason: clarity

November 24, 2012	#7
FreyaFL Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: SW FL Posts: 152	Great additional info! I think I might buy one of those misting sprayers to provide a wider range of coverage as I had to refill my 24 oz bottle 3 times just for my relatively small number of plants. (I definitely coverage well, though.) DON'T buy the expensive, 1 oz, stuff at the healthfood store. What I have is made for garden use and in a 16 oz bottle (100% neem oil, too). I'm sure the brands listed by the others is just as good. I've a question though! Is it okay to use this spray if it'll get on things like tomatoes, or zucchini, or other soon-to-be consumed produce? Last edited by FreyaFL; November 24, 2012 at 11:59 AM.

November 24, 2012	#8
kurt Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Homestead,Everglades City Fl. Posts: 2,491	http://www.horticulturesource.com/ac...sprayers-s101/ Keep in mind most of the feeding,breeding and egg laying goes on underneath the mater leaves.Got me 360 sprayers for that purpose. __________________ KURT Last edited by kurt; November 24, 2012 at 02:12 PM.

November 25, 2012	#11
kurt Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Homestead,Everglades City Fl. Posts: 2,491	At amazon if you buy $25.00 worth and sign up for the 30 day free Prime trial you get free shipping (2 days).Friend sent link.She got the Safer organic spray cheap with the sprayer same time. SOLO DIRECTIONAL SPRAYER W/ EXTENDA WAND [Item # 708590] __________________ KURT Last edited by kurt; November 25, 2012 at 08:55 AM. Reason: I got this one 1year ago and still going strong

November 23, 2012	#2
kilroyscarnival Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 614	Nodding and making a handwritten note. Sounds good, Freya. The local woman whose blog I started reading, and whose stuff I have bought at a nearby farmer's market, said she only uses neem oil for pest and fungus control when someone asked her. Is all neem oil the same or are there good and bad brands/extractions? I'll ask that generally, but what brand did you buy?

November 23, 2012	#4
ginger2778 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Plantation, Florida zone 10 Posts: 9,283	Here's the neem I use, I order 2 at a time. It's pretty reasonable and you have to use it often. :http://www.gardensafe.com/products-a...ncentrate.aspx Neem is supposed to be anti bacterial, antifungal, and insecticidal to soft bodied insects such as whiteflies, and they can never develop resistance to it like they can with a pesticide. Mix with a little soap as a wetting agent about a teaspoon for a 2 gallon sprayer, and I use 3 TBSP per gallon of the neem oil.Shake often while spraying, and only spray early AM or late afternoon to avoid frying the plant's leaves in the bright sun. It is totally organic, and it has something in it that inhibits growth of new whiteflies. Good stuff. I can't remember for sure but I think the shipping was free for the 2. -Marsha

November 25, 2012	#14
Tracydr Tomatovillian™ Join Date: May 2011 Location: Laurinburg, North Carolina, zone 7 Posts: 3,207	Glad to read this, as I just noticed a bunch of whiteflies on flowers and eggplants. Will give this a try.