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Old July 21, 2017   #16
Worth1
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Anything that looks like that around healthy plants gets the ax not worth saving seeds from and every one of those tomatoes will get ripe eventually.
I would do the cut test now.
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Old July 21, 2017   #17
Hntrss
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So I pulled it, and unfortunately I believe you were right on FW. AND from searching threads it seems my garden is now contaminated forever? It's a small raised bed, how deep do I have to dig to get rid of contaminated soil?
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Old July 21, 2017   #18
Father'sDaughter
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I'm so sorry to see that...

Is this a new bed, or one you've planted tomatoes in before?

I had a couple of great years with my raised beds filled with purchased compost, they were built two years apart so two different batches of compost. Then suddenly one year leaves on most of my tomato plants started turning screaming yellow. I was told by many that it probably wasn't fusarium given my location. So I kept trying, and things just got worse no matter which bed I planted them in. Last year most of my plants were killed after producing only one or two tomatoes. I also started suspecting I had verticillium as well.

I'm no expert, but I think in my case there are two possibilities.

I could have planted seeds that hadn't been properly processed and introduced it, but it was suddenly too wide spread through the entire tomato section so I don't think that was it. (Note -- there has been a discussion going on in a thread here on Fusarium and whether or not it's transmitted by seeds. Conclusion was that there is currently no evidence that it's carried inside seeds, only on the surface of improperly processed seeds.)

The other is that the soil under my beds (which used to be lawn) was infected and it just took it a few years to work its way up into my beds. I suspect this to be the case.

I grafted this year and have plants loaded up with fruit. The only ones that are struggling and have now started to go down are the four grafted onto rootstock with just F resistance. The rest are grafted onto rootstock with both F and V resistance and are doing fine.

I hope you can try growing in another location next year and hopefully have better success.

And if the other plants are showing some resistance so far, there is no reason to remove them until they too turn into wilted and eventually crispy critters. Hopefully they hang on long enough to get some fruit to at least the blushing stage!
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Old July 21, 2017   #19
AlittleSalt
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There are galls in/on the roots in the first picture. The plant also has RKN.

I'm sorry.
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Old July 21, 2017   #20
Hntrss
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So far everything else is ok and has plenty of fruit. Last year I got wiped out , but attributed it to excessive heat. Wrongly , in hindsight. Can you dig out the soil and replace it? 2 feet down we have a very sandy substrate here on Long Island . There is no other place for me to have a garden unfortunately. It seems unreal that there is nothing you can do.....
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Old July 21, 2017   #21
gorbelly
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You can:

1) Choose RKN and F (and I would suggest V for good measure) resistant varieties. Note that there are different races of both F and V, so either determine which race(s) you have (probably an expensive endeavor) or choose varieties with resistance to all or experiment with plants with resistance to different types to narrow down which it might be.

2) Grafting onto disease-resistant rootstock. There's a learning curve, but a lot of people on here are doing it, and you can get some good tips. You can always practice throughout the year with extra seed or cheap seed you get on sale at a big box store or something so that you have confidence in your success rate when it comes time to do your starts for real.

3) Growing in containers. You can put the containers on your infected bed if you don't have space elsewhere. Make sure there's a good barrier underneath the containers and/or raise them up well off the soil so that they don't get contaminated.
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Old July 21, 2017   #22
gorbelly
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You can also try amending with a lot of organic matter and using biological root treatments/soil drenches next year. If we get a real winter this year as opposed to the ridiculously mild conditions we had last year, it's possible you may have later disease onset and get enough of a harvest. At least that will lessen the problems with RKNs, which accelerate the plant getting the disease due to the root damage they do which lets in the disease. If we get a good, cold winter in the NE that freezes the soil well, that might reduce RKN populations significantly.
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Old July 21, 2017   #23
Hntrss
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This is depressing- but I am game to graft. This is mostly a hobby for me so I am up to learn new methods . I just ate my first Orange Russian 117 sliced, first slice I just ate straight up, the rest on a tuna sandwich. Unreal flavor for me, and beautiful! The thought of giving up heirlooms altogether is not going to work, so I may try digging up the garden down to sand and buying soil, or grafting. I will keep you posted how the season progresses, I suspect my Rev Mike Keyes is doomed. It never really took off at all, kind of stopped progressing. If it shows more sign I will sacrifice it and check for RKN and FW.
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Old July 21, 2017   #24
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RKN like sandy soil, so if the soil in your area is sandy, I doubt replacing the top layer of soil in your garden will do all that much. It sounds like a lot of effort and cost for relatively little gain. Especially if you're going to go the grafting route anyway.
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Old July 21, 2017   #25
Father'sDaughter
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Grafting or container growing would just about guarantee success.

Trying to dig out and replace the soil is a long shot.

And if the problem(s) are actually in your native soil, which they very well may be, you'll be right back where you started.

At least you have time to observe what the rest of your plants do as this season progresses, consider options between now and next spring, and hopefully harvest tomatoes for a bit longer before the plants start dropping.
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Old July 21, 2017   #26
carolyn137
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlittleSalt View Post
I didn't want to reply to what I think it is, but it looks just like fusarium looked like in the early stages in our gardens.

Yes, Fusarium happens in New York https://nysipm.cornell.edu/agricultu...section-22-5-2
And if you look closely at that link you'll find that Fusarium is almost never a problem here in upstate NYS since it's a soilborne disease and up here the winters usually freeze the ground deeply,so kills the Fusarium as someone else here also noted.

The only problem with Fusarium is when nurseries and commercial growers have PLANTS shipped up from the south and get sold up here, I used to know the names of those places in the south that did that shipping but have forgtten their names.Not just tomato plants but also peppers,cabbage,cauliflower,etc.

But we do have what we call open winters here when the ground doesn't freeze much so yes F might be there for a year,but such winters are very rare here at all.

Yes,occasionaly we do see verticilium here but it usually self cures,at least in my experience.

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Old July 21, 2017   #27
Worth1
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Have a truck loaded with liquid Co2 or Nitrogen come out this fall and freeze the soil.

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Old July 21, 2017   #28
AlittleSalt
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I believe you Carolyn - (as always)
I clicked on this thread to say exactly what you did. Hntrss, if you get a good ground freezing winter - you shouldn't have anything to worry about from those two diseases next year.

In December of 1983, we /DFW Texas area had 295 consecutive hours with temperatures below freezing from the morning of the 18th until the afternoon of the 30th. I have never seen anything close to it freezing here that long before or after December of 83.
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Old July 21, 2017   #29
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Fusarium overwinters easily as chlamydospores. I think the real issue is how many days with high soil temps we get in the warm parts of the year. Fusarium can be in the soil and not cause disease as long as conditions aren't optimal for its growth during the warm seasons.

As things heat up, I think most northern areas will see many more recurring problems with diseases that were previously thought to be only southern problems.

Fus. is more common in areas with sandy soils, probably because these are also soils favored by RKNs, which help accelerate the disease.
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Old July 21, 2017   #30
RayR
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Of course Carolyn is right, Fusarium is extremely rare in NYS. The only real Fusarium infections I've read about were in some soybean fields in a few counties in central New York. So you have to wonder how Fusarium got there in the first place since it's an organism that's not native to the North and can't survives really cold winters.
It's far more likely to get Verticillium Wilt in the North than Fusarium.

And this RKN thing. Root Knot Nematodes are root feeding nematodes but there are many many species of root feeding nematodes that are not RKN's. RKN's are species in the genus Meloidogyne, They are not adapted to Northern climates with long frigid winters. They thrive in very hot climates down South. If they were to show up in the North at all they would have to have been imported from the South in contaminated soil.
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