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Old August 6, 2018   #1
clara
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Default Wild tomatoes - how do I recognize them?

Stupid question probably! I've grown many so-called wild tomatoes over the years - I had got them all labeled "wild tomato" and they all fitted to what I had read about them. But this season, I'm growing a variety called "Dream of Madagascar" without any infos other than the name. For several reasons, I can't ask the person who gave me the seeds. It seems to be an indet. plant (can't say it for sure because I made the mistake to put it into a hanging basket; it is VERY sprawling). The tomatoes are looking like very small eggs, orange or red, I'm not sure if the orange ones will turn into red, and are very sweet, but I have tasted only two tomatoes off the vine so far. The skin looks very mat, but that may be caused by lack of water/improperly watering during our incredible heat this year. Most trusses have 7 tomatoes.

COULD that be another wild tomato? And what is the correct definition of a "wild" tomato?

Madagascar is a very poor island, only rich in endemic, but mostly endangered flora and fauna.
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Old August 9, 2018   #2
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Stupid question probably! I've grown many so-called wild tomatoes over the years - I had got them all labeled "wild tomato" and they all fitted to what I had read about them. But this season, I'm growing a variety called "Dream of Madagascar" without any infos other than the name. For several reasons, I can't ask the person who gave me the seeds. It seems to be an indet. plant (can't say it for sure because I made the mistake to put it into a hanging basket; it is VERY sprawling). The tomatoes are looking like very small eggs, orange or red, I'm not sure if the orange ones will turn into red, and are very sweet, but I have tasted only two tomatoes off the vine so far. The skin looks very mat, but that may be caused by lack of water/improperly watering during our incredible heat this year. Most trusses have 7 tomatoes.

COULD that be another wild tomato? And what is the correct definition of a "wild" tomato?

Madagascar is a very poor island, only rich in endemic, but mostly endangered flora and fauna.
Clara,I suggest you contact Craig Le Houllier here at Tville, the reason being that his one daughter spent a year on Madacascar and she wrote a book about her experiences there.

What does wild mean when referring to tomatoes.

https://www.google.com/search?q=defi...&bih=815&dpr=1

I didn't read all the definitions, but I also include landraces as well,which are almost always unstable.

Carolyn, glad to see you aren't travelling this time of year,but are at home tending to your own tomatoes,but maybe not.
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Old August 9, 2018   #3
nbardo
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Default Wild tomatoes - how do I recognize them?

When most people say wild tomato I think they mean growing without any human intervention. The ones found outside of south and central america are probably all still descended from domesticated solanum lycopersicum. So they are more like feral than wild but i think thats what carolyn means by landraces, populations that are self sustaining and adapted to a location.

Truly wild undomesticated species are from south and central america used in breeding for things like disease resistance, but most of them are hard to cross with donesticated tomato. Those are solanum pimpinellifolium, s peruvianum, s chilense, s galapagense, and a handful of others.


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Old August 9, 2018   #4
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When most people say wild tomato I think they mean growing without any human intervention. The ones found outside of south and central america are probably all still descended from domesticated solanum lycopersicum. So they are more like feral than wild but i think thats what carolyn means by landraces, populations that are self sustaining and adapted to a location.

Truly wild undomesticated species are from south and central america used in breeding for things like disease resistance, but most of them are hard to cross with donesticated tomato. Those are solanum pimpinellifolium, s peruvianum, s chilense, s galapagense, and a handful of others.


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And if you don't have Keith Mueller's website you should

http://www.kdcomm.net/~tomato/tomato.htm

For MUCH more information about some of what you posted above.

Start by clicking on TOMATO at the top of the link above.

I have spent many hours at his site since there's so much info there.And once you see all of his site,including the references to other sites such as the Charles Rick data base site at UC Davis in CA I know you'll agree.

Carolyn
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Old August 9, 2018   #5
clara
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Many thanks, Carolyn and nbardo, for taking the time to answer me. I had already read a lot of German articles before asking my question here, but did not find the solution. Therefore I had thought of you, Carolyn.

I have started to have a look at the links you gave, but it will take some time till I have finished.

And no, at this time of the year, no holidays for me - who should water my plants? In this terribly hot summer, no tomato would survive without watering, so it was good to stay at home. Even WITH watering, the plants are suffering and the crop will be poorer than usually. But of course I have already booked my next holidays, in one of my favorite countries, and I shall visit new-to-me very interesting sites which I know you'd also like to see. South of where we usually go, a VERY remote place without internet...
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Old August 10, 2018   #6
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This is off topic, but my tomatoes survived on my hothouse balcony for a few days with a system of a bucket frull of water and a watering wick/piece of clothing. I was very sceptical about the potential of such an arrangement, but was very pleasantly surprised.
The bucket is now permanently attached to my largest tomato plant!
(one important detal: the piece of clothing serving as the wick needs its own plastic cover in order to stop the water from evaporating.. )
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Old August 15, 2018   #7
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Many thanks, Carolyn and nbardo, for taking the time to answer me. I had already read a lot of German articles before asking my question here, but did not find the solution. Therefore I had thought of you, Carolyn.

I have started to have a look at the links you gave, but it will take some time till I have finished.

And no, at this time of the year, no holidays for me - who should water my plants? In this terribly hot summer, no tomato would survive without watering, so it was good to stay at home. Even WITH watering, the plants are suffering and the crop will be poorer than usually. But of course I have already booked my next holidays, in one of my favorite countries, and I shall visit new-to-me very interesting sites which I know you'd also like to see. South of where we usually go, a VERY remote place without internet...
OK, I know you aren't going to Capetown S Africa,but here's where you might be going.

https://www.google.com/search?q=Vict...&bih=815&dpr=1

And when you look at the hotels the more expensive ones for that area,you'll also see that at the best of the best Hotels,yes,they do offer internet service.

And I also assume that your one son will accompany you, as usual.

Be sure to send me a postcard as you usually do.

Carolyn
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Old August 15, 2018   #8
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LOL, Carolyn, no, it's not that far south! It's still Egypt, but this time the Nasser Lake where also Abu Simbel is (which I've already visited twice, but either by a bus trip or a flight from Assuan). Our ship will drop anchor just in front of it. We shall also visit other sites on the lake or near the lake, and those are new to me. Only two cruise ships are actually on the Nasser Lake and we already know which one will be ours. And no, there is definitively no internet!

I shall send you a postcard, but only when I'm back home - last time, none of about 20 arrived...
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Old August 15, 2018   #9
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Her is some new,revelations bout the myth of Darwin,the migration.Good reading.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/03/w...ery-laser.html
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Old August 16, 2018   #10
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LOL, Carolyn, no, it's not that far south! It's still Egypt, but this time the Nasser Lake where also Abu Simbel is (which I've already visited twice, but either by a bus trip or a flight from Assuan). Our ship will drop anchor just in front of it. We shall also visit other sites on the lake or near the lake, and those are new to me. Only two cruise ships are actually on the Nasser Lake and we already know which one will be ours. And no, there is definitively no internet!

I shall send you a postcard, but only when I'm back home - last time, none of about 20 arrived...
I never, ever,thought you would go to an artificial lake created by the Aswan dam.

https://www.google.com/search?q=lake...&bih=815&dpr=1

And in your other thread,I can't remember where it is right now ,I think you should start a Go Fund Me page to raise money so that ALL German speaking/writing individuals can help preserve the TRUE umlaut. Q.E.D.



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Old August 18, 2018   #11
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Originally Posted by nbardo View Post
When most people say wild tomato I think they mean growing without any human intervention. The ones found outside of south and central america are probably all still descended from domesticated solanum lycopersicum. So they are more like feral than wild but i think thats what carolyn means by landraces, populations that are self sustaining and adapted to a location.

Truly wild undomesticated species are from south and central america used in breeding for things like disease resistance, but most of them are hard to cross with donesticated tomato. Those are solanum pimpinellifolium, s peruvianum, s chilense, s galapagense, and a handful of others.


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I realize that the OP was probably talking about feral tomatoes rather than truly wild tomato species, so my reply is probably not relevant. But regardless, i have started a wiki of my own to collect pictures and information regarding how to identify wild tomato species. They are all really unique and awesome! I am trying to only use photos that are already in the public domain or my own photos from my garden, or those given to me through permission.

Here is an example of an awesome photo i took this week of a Solanum peruvianum plant in my garden! Notice the awesome and unique leaf shape and silvery shade of the leaf color and the awesomely bold bright yellow showy flowers! I still need to add it to my wiki.

https://biolumo.com/index.php?title=...num_peruvianum

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Old August 19, 2018   #12
clara
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After reading a lot in the past days, I'd now call the tomato in question a feral tomato.

A few more details: The tomatoes remain orange and the skin is mat. What really amazed me when I tried to save seeds: Most seed chambers did not contain any seeds (but a very delicious gel) - or they were that tiny that I did not see them. When I fermented the seeds, I could only definitively identify 6 larger seeds (from about 12 or 13 tomatoes), the rest was so tiny that I was afraid they might slip through the strainer which they apparently did although the strainer is very fine.

In the meantime, I've picked more tomatoes, but not de-seeded them - hopefully there are more and larger seeds...

Next year, I'll regrow the Dream of Madagascar, but that time in a normal container. You may ask why - it's so very unusual and sweet, but above all: It serves my yen to go to distant places. Madagascar is one of them, but my health would not allow to go there, sigh...
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Old August 19, 2018   #13
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I realize that the OP was probably talking about feral tomatoes rather than truly wild tomato species, so my reply is probably not relevant. But regardless, i have started a wiki of my own to collect pictures and information regarding how to identify wild tomato species. They are all really unique and awesome! I am trying to only use photos that are already in the public domain or my own photos from my garden, or those given to me through permission.

Here is an example of an awesome photo i took this week of a Solanum peruvianum plant in my garden! Notice the awesome and unique leaf shape and silvery shade of the leaf color and the awesomely bold bright yellow showy flowers! I still need to add it to my wiki.

https://biolumo.com/index.php?title=...num_peruvianum

Keen, where HAVE you been,yes,I know in CO but not here at tville since this past April.

Are you still in interacting with Joseph?

Have you read Keith Mueller's website about species?

Great to see you back. And yes,I'm still connected to Colorado since a great friend,who is also a Tville member sends me melons from Rocky Ford on the western slope. Got them about a week ago,or so. Delish.

Carolyn
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Old August 19, 2018   #14
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Keen, where HAVE you been,yes,I know in CO but not here at tville since this past April.

Are you still in interacting with Joseph?

Have you read Keith Mueller's website about species?

Great to see you back. And yes,I'm still connected to Colorado since a great friend,who is also a Tville member sends me melons from Rocky Ford on the western slope. Got them about a week ago,or so. Delish.

Carolyn
Hi Carolyn, been very busy with life. Haven't even had much time in the garden that much of it has suffered, but 'tis life. A poor tomato year for me, but there's a few here and there.

I have a suspicion that i've seen Keith Mueller's website, but i'll try to go take a look when i get a chance. My website is currently having problems so it is down.

Yes, Joseph and i still talk and interact, though less frequently these days. I was the one who was able to send him and others F2 generation [Domestic x S. pennellii] hybrid seeds for the big wild tomato breeding project. From the literature i read on the pennellii species it has the widest range of aromatic and flavor chemicals and thus would make it the species most likeley to have unique new combinations of flavors perhaps not seen in domestic tomatoes thus far. I found the F1 hybrids to be VERY vigerous and to thrive in my garden even in areas with poor soil and dry conditions.

Nice, i have my watermelons going again this year, and though they too have suffered from neglect i have high hopes that at least a few will grow well enough to produce seeds to continue with.
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