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Old May 17, 2016   #1
weinerm
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Default Planted in Pure Compost - HELP!

I made raised beds this year and had compost delivered. I filled the raised beds with the compost and planted my tomatoes in them. I have recently found out that you are not supposed to use pure compost. You are supposed to mix it in with topsoil. I did not realize that. I have read mixed reviews on what happens to the plants in pure compost. Some reviews say that the compost will burn the plants. Some say that they will be just fine and that they may just need extra nitrogen because the compost uses up the nitrogen. The compost I got I believe is screened if that makes a difference. It is black and fine and loose. I think they called it Dirt Doctor Compost.

What are your thoughts? Will my plants be okay in the pure compost? Is there anything I can do to help them along? I am too far along to be able to mix in topsoil now. Any help you can give will be greatly appreciated! I don't want to loose my plants.

Thanks!
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Old May 17, 2016   #2
Delerium
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You will be fine. It's usually manure based compost that burns plants.
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Old May 17, 2016   #3
weinerm
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Thanks Delerium. That makes me feel better. Do you think I need to add extra nitrogen fertilizer?
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Old May 17, 2016   #4
dmforcier
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He!! no! Just stand back and let the poor things grow.
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Old May 17, 2016   #5
travis
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If the compost has been fully decomposed, and shows no signs of generating heat beyond ambient surrounding temperatures, then it has aged to the extent of becoming basically neutral medium, and will not burn your tomato plants.

I've seen tomato vines spouted voluntarily, mature and bearing ripe fruit, in mounds of decomposed municipal sewage sludge stockpiled at treatment plants, if that helps demonstrate my point.

As to the nitrogen issue, yes, decomposing organic material will partially or significantly deplete its nitrogen content in the process of decomposition. It depends upon the original content of nitrogen whether sufficient content remains to support healthy vegetative growth without supplementing with fertilizers.

Your tomato leaves will tell you if the vines require additional nitrogen as well as other nutrients. If the leaves begin to yellow evenly and steadily from the bottom of the vine upward, that indicates the plants are moving nitrogen out of the lower leaves and up to the emerging growing tips where it is critical to new foliage development. In that case, you should fertilize with a product formulated specifically for tomatoes, or roses, whichever you have on hand or is available to purchase.

The most critical time to add nitrogen, other than if you notice the steady, even yellowing of lower leaves, is upon heavy fruit set when you want to re-stimulate healthy foliage growth to facilitate strong photosynthesis which is what produces the sugar and carbs that make for tasty tomatoes.

But be careful when deploying nitrogen as excessive application will put the plants into foliage-only mode, at the expense of blossom production and fruit set, which is the reason I mentioned using a fertilizer designed for tomatoes or roses.

Pay attention to the label directions as to applications ... and particularly, read your leaves.

Last edited by travis; May 17, 2016 at 12:24 PM.
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Old May 17, 2016   #6
pecker88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by weinerm View Post
I made raised beds this year and had compost delivered. I filled the raised beds with the compost and planted my tomatoes in them. I have recently found out that you are not supposed to use pure compost. You are supposed to mix it in with topsoil. I did not realize that. I have read mixed reviews on what happens to the plants in pure compost. Some reviews say that the compost will burn the plants. Some say that they will be just fine and that they may just need extra nitrogen because the compost uses up the nitrogen. The compost I got I believe is screened if that makes a difference. It is black and fine and loose. I think they called it Dirt Doctor Compost.

What are your thoughts? Will my plants be okay in the pure compost? Is there anything I can do to help them along? I am too far along to be able to mix in topsoil now. Any help you can give will be greatly appreciated! I don't want to loose my plants.

Thanks!

I almost did the same thing!!

See here, post #74:
http://www.tomatoville.com/showthrea...t=39087&page=5

I ended up wheelbarrow'ing about 1/2 of the compost back OUT of the greenhouse, and adding in sandy loam top soil.

If it makes you feel any better, my tomatoes and peppers look like CRAP, they have been planted out for about 3-4 weeks. All different heirlooms/varieties that looked great when transplanted, but now they all have curled new growth. The new growth curls upward, toward the main vein of the leaf. The undersides of all new foliage is also dark purple where it's shaded from the sun.

Onions, radishes, potatoes, beans, broccoli seem to be doing great.
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Old May 17, 2016   #7
weinerm
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Thanks dmforcier and travis. That makes me feel better.

pecker88 - sorry to hear that about your tomatoes. Hopefully mine with full compost will do alright. I really don't have much of a choice now but let it ride and see how it goes.
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Old May 17, 2016   #8
Labradors2
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I'm sure they will be fine! We set up a new bed last summer. Aged cow manure was free and close by, so that is what we used. I grew eggplants and pepper plants that I bought from the store, and everything grew very well.

Linda
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Old May 17, 2016   #9
AlittleSalt
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Here is a picture of a volunteer tomato plant growing in compost. The compost was made of grasses/weeds, oak leaves, and vegetables/plants/etc. It seems to be growing fine.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg HNI_0089.JPG (101.7 KB, 167 views)
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Old May 17, 2016   #10
oakley
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I think you will be fine....just watch like a hawk and many things are available to 'amend' if caught
right away.
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Old May 17, 2016   #11
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I decided to see what this comercial Dirt Doctor Compost was all about.

Here's the Google search

https://www.google.com/search?q=Dirt..._AUIBigA&dpr=1

And now the first link from that and from all I read he certainly has a large commercial business going.

https://www.dirtdoctor.com/garden/Co...ing_vq2540.htm

Now in this last link he says to use anything alive, and in one of the Google link he says to add dog poo.

Last I knew dog poo is not by itself alive, sure live bacteria and other live stuff as well and any parasites that said dog might be infected with and if in the dormant state,not too sure that aging the poo would eliminate all that stuff.

Nope,not me,not going to use anything used to develop a compost heap that has any dog,cat, etc., poo, but then it's also good to know that I spent most of my professional life teaching infectious diseases to med students,including what are called zoonotic diseases,ones share by both humans and non humans.

So am I at least partially paranoid about this subject,yes,I think I am.

Another concern is the following and pardon me for linking to an article I was asked to write.

http://www.webgrower.com/information/carolyn_ber.html

In the long BER thread someone linked to this and I 'd forgtten I had written it, but as it says,grow in in too rich soil, can lead to BER and in that other thread I also posted that too rapid growth keeps a plant in the vegetative phase of new roots and stems and foliage so it delays the normal conversion to the sexual phase of blossom formation,pollenization,fruit set and fruit maturation.

In addition,when plants are not in balance they can also have upside down leaves and more. I wish I had fetched that BER link,it's still on the first page,but too late now since I don 't want to lose the links I have here now.

Carolyn, who,if given a choice between poo laden composting ingredients and what can happen when plants grow too rapidly, would probably chose the latter,not the former,since as she's already pointed out she's probably,well,semi-paranoid about poo.
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Old May 17, 2016   #12
creister
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Carolyn,

In your google search it was Dirt Doctors Compost, located in NH. Howard Garrett is the dirt doctor and he is located in the Dallas metro area. I am pretty sure he does not sell anything using his name. Of the products he recommends, I've never seen Dirt Doctors as a brand he promotes. So I think two different entities are using the same/similar name.

Last edited by creister; May 17, 2016 at 03:06 PM. Reason: Add text
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Old May 17, 2016   #13
carolyn137
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Quote:
Originally Posted by creister View Post
Carolyn,

In your google search it was Dirt Doctors Compost, located in NH. Howard Garrett is the dirt doctor and he is located in the Dallas metro area. I am pretty sure he does not sell anything using his name. Of the products he recommends, I've never seen Dirt Doctors as a brand he promotes. So I think two different entities are using the same/similar name.
But, but,the link I gave says Howard Garrett right at the top..

https://www.dirtdoctor.com/garden/Co...ing_vq2540.htm

And the general google search I did also cites him in many ways from U tubes,to products he sells,etc.

https://www.dirtdoctor.com/garden/Co...ing_vq2540.htm

And yes,on that Google list there is a link to a dirt doctor in NH, but that isn't Garrett

http://dirtdoctorsnh.com/

And if you click on Products,this is the way to find those stores that sell his products.

https://www.dirtdoctor.com/products

Carolyn
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Old May 17, 2016   #14
Durgan
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I never grow anything in pure compost. In fact I have a pile in the garden area and few things grow well in it. I always insure it is mixed with the underlying soil. Mine is city compost. A well rotted manure pile certainly has vigorous growth round the periphery of the pile.

My own vegetative compost has many healthy weeds growing as compared to the city compost.

I must say compost usually has has a nice appearance, but there is necessary nutrients missing.

To extend this further, mushroom compost is touted now and then, but it grows nothing since the mushroom factory certainty doe not discard a medium with any nutrient value left.

Bottom line, compost alone is not sufficient for growing healthy plants.
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Old May 17, 2016   #15
weinerm
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Thanks everybody for the feedback - I greatly appreciate it!
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