Indoor Winter Tomato Project

[lakelady]

Originally Posted by coloken

I too have been growing or trying to grow inside. Many nice comments here.
My comment is as much light as you can get. I have used CFL if you can find the bigger ones. I make my own reflector from air duct tube and socket.
I just wanted to warn you that if you have grow lights going, sooner or later you are going to have a knock on the door and the nice men will say "can I come in?" then "what are you growing?", Don't get excited--it happen quite often and no problem as long as you are not growing the wrong stuff. A red LED unit will really attract them. Been there.

So those LEDs attract attention too? Good thing I'm only growing tomatoes because when I had the seedlings out on the porch that darn light lit up the whole neighborhood (it's very very dark here at night as I have a forest across the street)....you could see it from down the street ....my sons thought it was a "cool" nightlight!

[z_willus_d]

Speaking of LEDs, I got my disco array setup yesterday. I took a half day from work and solicited the help of my father to setup the incredibly difficult to assemble rack that I purchased on Amazon (difficult because of the caster assembly, not rack itself). Anyway, we got the shelving setup with wheels, added one rack at the very bottom and one a the very top, attached my led to the top rack and hung it down the center-line, wrapped 2m mylar sheeting around two of the shelving sides and carefully rolled it from my living-room to the kitchen where I set it next to an East facing window (open side).

You can see from my first pic what my kitchen looks like now, and suffice it to say my lovely wife is more than nonplussed with the addition. The LED light is quite loud actually, as it has 4 (what look like 120mm fans) running to cool the 8 heat-sinked LED modules. So far, I haven't noticed any increased heat in the area, but it was cooler yesterday (had the window open there) and those fans are LOUD.

The other pics show my broccoli and cauliflower seedlings, which I sprouted using that mass seeding (dense planting) method that Craig (nctomatoman) described so well. It worked quite nicely for these. My problem is that they got a bit to necky stretching for light when I only had a single T12 fluorescent shedding light on the. Also, they want to be in the 60-65F range, and I've had them stuck in my often hot kitchen in a wide range of 65-85F. I'm hoping the new light will help with their stretching. I'll be planting these as soon as the whether cools down here and when I get the heart to pull my tomato vines out (most of which are still producing lesser sires).

That last pic is just something for fun that provides what I tell myself is the explanation for spending a fortune on an indoor planting setup. Having slices of fresh, ripe heirloom for my homemade pizza makes all the difference. Having something to slice in the late, cold Winter would be amazing. We'll see if I get far enough to repudiate my likely flawed $$$-->pleasure logic.

--naysen

[lakelady]

oh my, you aren't kidding when you said DISCO! lol.... They look very cool though. Do they really need fans to cool? I thought LEDs didn't need fans to cool them?

[Mandy97]

This is my first winter trying to grow tomatoes indoors. I picked Sophie's choice and Hahms Gelbe Topftomate... along with some lettuce and herbs too.

I wish us all a good winter growing season!

[z_willus_d]

Originally Posted by lakelady

Do they really need fans to cool? I thought LEDs didn't need fans to cool them?

Yep, these are 1W LEDs and there are a lot of them. Some LED lights use 3W devices and run even hotter. Actually, any single device isn't that bad, but taken as a whole they can slowly heat up the general area. To help with this, they are mounted with a heat sink (metal aluminum I think with fins). The heat sink is no good without something to blow air across it and transmit that "thermal mass" to somewhere else. Also, I've read the number one cause of early death for these 50K+ life LEDs is running them hot. They'll last much longer if nice and cool.

It really does trip you out if you stare in it's general direction for a while. My colors get out of whack, and the thing is so bright it can screw with the aperture settings in your eye balls, especially at night when walking in from a dark room wide eyed.

Keep us posted...

[lakelady]

Well, I'm probably not as organized as you are about all this lol....

Dumb question: What's a "W" ? Watt?

At present, I have several in pots under one growlight in the bay window, and the rest are still in tiny pots ...now on the screen porch, inside my little rolling 4 shelf "greenhouse" on wheels, with a plastic cover, and Christmas lights inside to keep it a bit toasty as our nights have gotten very cool down to 50 degrees. It really looks like quite a setup out there ha! But, I gave away 3 seedlings yesterday to one neighbor, and I've promised 4 other friends/neighbors a plant to try and grow indoors, so I think it's pretty neat that other people are actually interested in trying it! Granted, they are probably not doing all the lights that we are, but even one little growlight for one little plant won't be so bad. I have 6 silver fir tree seedlings and I don't need t hem all and also the Big Dwarf seedlings, so they will go to good homes. Tonight I typed up some instructions for each new owner about remembering to pollinate them or setup a fan to do so or they will not get tomatoes for Christmas! My little seedlings are now 1 month old...and steadily growing. Have not lost one yet, so I'm pretty happy about that.

I did put the White Rabbit in a small 1 gallon pot and I have Sweet Pea and Spoon in hanging planters. If they make it, great, if they don't , then I know better for next summer. I don't expect them to be as large as they would outdoors, but since they are sprawling plants from what I've read, maybe keeping them contained in smaller pots isn't such a bad thing.

Still need to find that darn powercord for the camera though.....

[z_willus_d]

Originally Posted by lakelady

Dumb question: What's a "W" ? Watt?

You are correct. I meant W to stand for Watt, a measure of power, and in the inefficient case of most all human made light sources I know, heat.

Looking forward to seeing some pics. I've got four small 1" tall seedlings from my New Dwarf sprouts. Two have their first true leaves inching out just today. I've got them under the LED light at night and on the south facing window couch arm through the day. They don't lack for lumens I think.

[lakelady]

Are tomatoes daylight sensitive? I ask because I was under the impression they are not, yet I've seen websites saying that they are and that shorter daylight hours are needed to induce flowering. I'm sure someone here will give me the correct answer because right now I only keep lights over my tiny plants for about 14 hours a day. thanks

[z_willus_d]

Originally Posted by lakelady

Are tomatoes daylight sensitive? I ask because I was under the impression they are not, yet I've seen websites saying that they are and that shorter daylight hours are needed to induce flowering. I'm sure someone here will give me the correct answer because right now I only keep lights over my tiny plants for about 14 hours a day. thanks

Everything I've heard and read on the subject suggests that there are generally two phases of growth. The vegetative, and the bloom/fruiting. In fact, those stages can repeat with recurrence and I'm sure it's a lot more complicated than just that. But with respect to indoor lighting, I think you want 16-18 hours of light during the vegetative stage (pre-bloom) and then once the plants start to put out blooms (or perhaps when they are large/mature enough that they otherwise should be), change your lighting schedule to a 12-on, 12-off regiment. I think you want to set a schedule and keep it, so if you were in an entirely enclosed, light tight grow tent, you could have your grow light on for 12 hours at night and then turn it off during the day (perhaps to try and moderate temp spikes).

I think it's also important to try and ensure it's actually dark during the 12 "dark" hours, so if you're like me and you have the plants setup to take light through windows during the day hours, you'll probably want to augment the daylight with your lamps for 12-hours and set up a time-table where things go dark at night. Thus if the sun sets at 6pm and rises at 6am, you'd want to run the lamps during the hours 600 through 1800 (6pm). And let the plants set in darkness between 1800 and 600 (6am). That's all after you've gotten through that initial vegetative grown stage/phase, during which 18-hours light should be fine.

My limited understanding of the topic...
-naysen

[dice]

Quieter fans (probably):
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/56...iet-120mm-case

I have had 120mm Vantec Stealths for a decade in cases with any 120mm
fan mounts. They are pretty quiet. (The jury-rigged 40mm Delta that
I used to replace the anemic OEM fan on top of the heat sink on a pIII
makes more noise than 4 other, larger fans in the same case all
together. That pIII still works, though.)

I see from that thread that there are some newer, quieter 120mm
offerings now.

[z_willus_d]

Yeah dice- I've built up computer systems in the past (more often than I care to have), and I always look for the quietest fan options. It's amazing the value a little silence can bring. All that whirling and whirring white-noise can deaden the world really fast.

As for the four fans in my LED lamp, I'm a bit loathe to replace them with self-purchased fans given that the company actually highlighted the quietness of their fans as a pro for their solution. Also, the warranty would most certainly void on entry (furthermore on fan replacement), and the longer than average warranty was one of the things I paid for with my $$'s spent on this product.

[dice]

Also, the warranty would most certainly void on entry (furthermore on fan replacement), and the longer than average warranty was one of the things I paid for with my $$'s spent on this product.

Fair enough. (What is the warranty on the wife?)

[lakelady]

Oh yeah, definately don't want to void warrantees....I've done that before ugh...

I can appreciate the value of silence myself as someone who lives with two teenagers, when it gets quiet, I want it quiet . Bad enough the boys think my light interferes with TV viewing, if I had to add noise, there would definately be an uprising (and I would win).

Okay....so I'm thinking about the light and hours of light. It's hard for me to determine what's going to happen because I'm waiting for the leaves to fall from the trees and then I will have a lot more bright sunlight in those sliding glass doors. Right now, as small seedlings, they are easy to keep under one light on the porch but that will change soon.

I went to the garden center this week and found the neatest small pots with attached cages that I'm thinking might work for the dwarfs. Well, at least for the Silver Fir Tree, which is somewhat dwarf. Wouldn't have to worry about ties and stakes or a self made cage, nice and neat. And since I am using two different windows in two different rooms, I think the dwarfs will fit into the bay window, and the two taller plants in the kitchen (or more if I wanted ) on the floor. Since I'm going to rely on natural light as well as artificial, I was thinking of those lazy susan type gizmos to be able to easily turn the plants if they start growing towards the windows. Especially as they get bigger, I'm not crazy about damaging plants to turn them. I saw some that are also drain catchers you can put under pots that I might try.

Considering the reflective surface option... I could always put something together with PVC pipes and make a 3 sided stand if needed and leave the window side open to the natural light.

[lakelady]

Here are the seedlings on 9/3....they were sown on 8/23, so about 2 weeks old. Now they have grown quite a bit more, but I did notice the dwarf plants seem to grow a lot slower than the regular plants (I guess it's all relative!). I'll have to take new pics and upload them maybe over the weekend.

Gosh I hope I get at least a few tomatoes after all this work ...

Oh, and the little plant in the center bottom is not a tomato, it's a Datura.

[john.barnesjr]

Hey that is great im trying the thing here in montana growing tomatoes in winter, and the varieties im growing are tiny tim, new big dwarf, and new livingston dwarf stone. I have already stared my tiny tims and they are doing great. I purchased a passive type hydroponic system called the auto pot. These systems I hear work great and I and also getting a Blackstar 240W led grow light for the tomato plants. I wish you the best I will try to post some pictures soon.