How to save seed? - Page 2

michael johnson · August 15, 2006

I was pleased to read the post which gave the links to the commercial seed production and drying etc, which was very interesting to say the least.

But-the only thing that alarmed me a bit- was the one about the mechanised method of seed production- first the acid bath, then the treading on the pulp and bashing it about in a mesh bag or whatever, and various other methods before final seed is ready.-it sure does seem to be rather rough treatment, and suprises me just how much rough handling the actual seed can take.

On one of the other posts the daves garden one:- the person there said they had maximum germination from tomatoes harvested just on the breaking stage- what exactly do they mean by that ?, does it mean only just begining to turn red or whatever !!

feldon30 · August 15, 2006

Just beginning to turn red, that's right.

michael johnson · August 16, 2006

Thats real interesting info- perhaps Carolyn was right after all " when she said -tomatoes are deemed ripe when they show the first touch of red- sometime back this year.

personaly- I have always only saved seed from realy ripe tomatoes left on the vine to mature, but having read all the above info- I might have to change my views on that after all !!!,

So- starting this season, I am going to carry out a bit of a personal experiment with this, and save some seed from about half a dozen of my best tomatoes just at the breaking stage-( just showing the first red colour ) and half a dozen of the same tomatoes left on the vine to become fully ripe, then next spring sow equal amounts of counted out seeds in exactly the same compost and see what happens- if the results are positive in favour of the ( just breaking colour toms) then I am indeed learning a new trick- isnt it amazing how one never stops learning about tomatoes over many-many long years of struggling.

**carolyn137** · August 16, 2006

Thats real interesting info- perhaps Carolyn was right after all " when she said -tomatoes are deemed ripe when they show the first touch of red- sometime back this year.

No, I never said that tomatoes were RIPE when they showed the first touch of red ( insert here first touch of any color). What I've said is that when they show some color that the seeds are OK to harvest.

Commercially, tomatoes are referred to by breaker stages and there are four of them/

Breaker # 1 is green fruit with no color

Breaker #2 is a touch of color at the blossom end as Keith showed.

Breaker #3 is color about half way up.

Breaker #4 is an almost ripe tomato fruit.

michael johnson · August 17, 2006

Sorry Carolyn- I just got the words in the wrong context- but it virtualy amounts to the same meaning.

But I am still a little suprised that the seeds are ready for harvesting from what I used to deem as unripe tomatoes and this new ( to me ) concept is going to take a little getting used to- but I fully intend to carry out little experiments over the next couple of seasons to compare results from it.

From the several types of breaker stages you outlined- which one do you think would be the one to give the best results for germination - as a rough guideline to get started with.

**carolyn137** · August 18, 2006

From the several types of breaker stages you outlined- which one do you think would be the one to give the best results for germination - as a rough guideline to get started with.

Michael, as I've said before, I much prefer using ripe tomatoes off the vine for seed saving. But there have been times when first frost neared and I needed to harvest partially ripe fruits, my most famous story about that being the variety Magnus, and in that case and other similar ones I try to protect the fruits on the vine until they are colored up about half way, breaker #3. if not, I go for breaker #2, but never green tomatoes although I do know someone who does get viable seeds from totally green tomatoes but I think it must be variety related in that particular situation.

michael johnson · August 18, 2006

Thank you Carolyn, I think I will try a bit of experimenting with Breaker # 2 and 3 for a start and see what results from that.

I expect so will quite a lot of other people too- who have read this whole post and want to try a bit of experimenting- it seems well worth the effort.

The only problem that I can see though- is what to do with all the pulp afterwards, as you cant realy eat it with a fresh salad as ripe tomatoes, so it looks like green'ish tomato chutney is on the cards for this winter.

August 15, 2006	#17
feldon30 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: May 2006 Location: Rock Hill, SC Posts: 5,346	Just beginning to turn red, that's right. __________________ [SIZE="3"]I've relaunched my gardening website -- [B]TheUnconventionalTomato.com[/B][/SIZE] * [I][SIZE="1"]*I'm not allowed to post weblinks so you'll have to copy-paste it manually.[/SIZE][/I]

August 16, 2006	#19
carolyn137 Moderator Emeritus Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a Posts: 21,169	Thats real interesting info- perhaps Carolyn was right after all " when she said -tomatoes are deemed ripe when they show the first touch of red- sometime back this year. No, I never said that tomatoes were RIPE when they showed the first touch of red ( insert here first touch of any color). What I've said is that when they show some color that the seeds are OK to harvest. Commercially, tomatoes are referred to by breaker stages and there are four of them/ Breaker # 1 is green fruit with no color Breaker #2 is a touch of color at the blossom end as Keith showed. Breaker #3 is color about half way up. Breaker #4 is an almost ripe tomato fruit. __________________ Carolyn

August 18, 2006	#21
carolyn137 Moderator Emeritus Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a Posts: 21,169	From the several types of breaker stages you outlined- which one do you think would be the one to give the best results for germination - as a rough guideline to get started with. Michael, as I've said before, I much prefer using ripe tomatoes off the vine for seed saving. But there have been times when first frost neared and I needed to harvest partially ripe fruits, my most famous story about that being the variety Magnus, and in that case and other similar ones I try to protect the fruits on the vine until they are colored up about half way, breaker #3. if not, I go for breaker #2, but never green tomatoes although I do know someone who does get viable seeds from totally green tomatoes but I think it must be variety related in that particular situation. __________________ Carolyn

August 15, 2006	#16
michael johnson Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: UK. Posts: 960	I was pleased to read the post which gave the links to the commercial seed production and drying etc, which was very interesting to say the least. But-the only thing that alarmed me a bit- was the one about the mechanised method of seed production- first the acid bath, then the treading on the pulp and bashing it about in a mesh bag or whatever, and various other methods before final seed is ready.-it sure does seem to be rather rough treatment, and suprises me just how much rough handling the actual seed can take. On one of the other posts the daves garden one:- the person there said they had maximum germination from tomatoes harvested just on the breaking stage- what exactly do they mean by that ?, does it mean only just begining to turn red or whatever !!

August 17, 2006	#20
michael johnson Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: UK. Posts: 960	Sorry Carolyn- I just got the words in the wrong context- but it virtualy amounts to the same meaning. But I am still a little suprised that the seeds are ready for harvesting from what I used to deem as unripe tomatoes and this new ( to me ) concept is going to take a little getting used to- but I fully intend to carry out little experiments over the next couple of seasons to compare results from it. From the several types of breaker stages you outlined- which one do you think would be the one to give the best results for germination - as a rough guideline to get started with.