Joe Bratka's tomatoes

[Tormato]

I keep misplacing my list(s) (I've made and misplaced this more than once) of his tomato varieties.

As I'm hopefully going to try once again (in 2016) to trial all of his introductions, I'm looking for help in again compiling the list.

[travis]

Maybe you can sort thru these links and find some of what you're seeking:

http://tatianastomatobase.com/w/inde...rch=joe+bratka

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by travis

Maybe you can sort thru these links and find some of what you're seeking:

http://tatianastomatobase.com/w/inde...rch=joe+bratka

That's a good link Bill, and you'll see my name in many of the entries. Most from getting certain varieties from him.

All to say that recently someone asked the same question here, I don't know how to find it where I discussed Joe, whom I knew very well, and he passed away just a few years ago, and his niece, he never mentioned he had a niece, came here looking for his varieties.

Some research was done on his background noting where his parent's were from in germany using immigration records and more, and Joe lived alone in their home until he died.

If you go to Tania's page for any one of the ones I germinated for him that he found in a tool shed on the property it should indicate which of them I was able to germinate, all bred by his father.

http://t.tatianastomatobase.com:88/wiki/Box_Car_Willie

Well, there were many more than what Tanialists but there were three I couldn't revive.

There were only three true heirlooms he had from the Black Forest and those are

Eva Purple Ball
Marizol Gold
Marizol Purple

I had a German lady as a student and she pointed out that there was a town/village in the black Forest called Maria's Zell and it makes sense that the contraction of that is probably Marizol/

Joe did breed someof the varieties such as Snow white, Ghost and Rabbit and said he did, but most of what he offered he wrongly attributed to his relatives in Germany, and there were none there. He said if folks wanted heirloom varieties he would breed them, and he did, and folks who knew no different believed him.

Gary, if you have anyspecific info you need to know just contact me since I knewJoe since 1991 and we corresponded a lot, via written communication as well as phone, he had no computer.

I don't know if you're interested in the ones his father bred and named or his true heirloom ones or his fake heirloom ones, which were the largest group he did breed.

I ask you that whatever you do you point out the fake heirloom ones vs the three true ones b'c I don't want to see the wrong info out there perpetuated.

Finally, I'll say that Joe was a bit strange and his niece agreed. He never worked, ever, he wouldn't answer the phone, he did have a message machine, unless he knew you, what he ate was not thatnormal,and the fact that he never mentioned to me he had a niece was to me also strange since I knew more about him than anyone else.

His letters that he sent out with his list of varieties were a work of art. He had these rubber stamps in different colors,most said Farmer Joe, others were of flowers and they covered the front and back of the envelopes leaving only room for address to on the front.

Carolyn

[habitat_gardener]

Originally Posted by carolyn137

...
Joe did breed someof the varieties such as Snow white, Ghost and Rabbit and said he did, but most of what he offered he wrongly attributed to his relatives in Germany, and there were none there. He said if folks wanted heirloom varieties he would breed them, and he did, and folks who knew no different believed him....

Finally, I'll say that Joe was a bit strange and his niece agreed. He never worked, ever, he wouldn't answer the phone, he did have a message machine, unless he knew you, what he ate was not thatnormal,and the fact that he never mentioned to me he had a niece was to me also strange since I knew more about him than anyone else.

His letters that he sent out with his list of varieties were a work of art. He had these rubber stamps in different colors,most said Farmer Joe, others were of flowers and they covered the front and back of the envelopes leaving only room for address to on the front.

Carolyn

Carolyn, I know you've often said you're not going to write another book, but wow, what a fun book that would be. I could even see it as a movie.

[Runescape]

Originally Posted by habitat_gardener

Carolyn, I know you've often said you're not going to write another book, but wow, what a fun book that would be. I could even see it as a movie.

Yeah, or at least a documentary...

Here's a quote from this thread from 2007: http://tomatoville.com/showthread.php?t=6658

Originally Posted by carolyn137

He's a sometime vegetarian and was always trying to get me to buy this Vitamix juicer.

He's sent me pictures of his gardens, but never one of himself. He grew everything on a narrow city lot and plants were so entwined I don't know how he kept things straight.

I think he would have loved to have been a farmer and have lots of land. On the envelopes he sent to me he had one rubber stamp that said Farmer Joe and that was stamped all over the envelopes.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by Runescape

Yeah, or at least a documentary...

Here's a quote from this thread from 2007: http://tomatoville.com/showthread.php?t=6658

Thanks so much for that link b/c that's the one I was talking about and did have a bit more info than I posted above, especially about the confusion at Territorial Seeds. What happened is that Tim/Tom?, the owner, sent me seeds for both and asked me to grow them out and confirm they were at least correct for the variety, ignoring the wrong background info, and they were. I had contacted him about the wrong history and he thanked me very much.

When at a website or vendor place and I saw something that was wrong I used to try and help by pointing out the problem, but quite frankly that seldom worked since many of the vendors, especially, would change nothing.

One that bothered me a lot was at a website where Belarusian Orange was listed, to indicate a very rare variety, I knew better since it was Andrey in Belarus who had sent me Orange-1 and I'd grown it.

http://t.tatianastomatobase.com:88/wiki/Orange-1

Ah yes, the Vitamix issue, he kept on and on trying to get me to buy one, I never did.

Carolyn

[travis]

With regard to Eva's Purple Ball, or Eva Purple Ball (whichever may be correct), and its close similarities to Redfield Beauty, do you think they may actually be the same tomato, Carolyn?

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by travis

With regard to Eva's Purple Ball, or Eva Purple Ball (whichever may be correct), and its close similarities to Redfield Beauty, do you think they may actually be the same tomato, Carolyn?

Bill, I wrote about that in my heirloom tomato book, I'm assuming you have that book somewhere, probably holding up a table leg, but for those who don't have it, here's a link to Google Books with the text of what I wrote.

https://books.google.com/books?id=y4...oville&f=false

I don't have a good answer except to say I wonder how Redfield Beauty found its way to a small village in the Black Forest of Germany.

The correct name is Eva Purple Ball as Joe first co-listed it with me in the 1991 SSE Yearbook, I have no idea who first put that apostrophe in there, and not correct

http://tatianastomatobase.com/wiki/Eva_Purple_Ball

Tania said it was only me who listed it but I'm sure it was Joe who also listed it since I had talked him into it.I had paid for him to be a member thinking he might be interested in some other tomato varieties, but after one year he didn't want to be bothered by any requests and exited left.

Carolyn

[nctomatoman]

Redfield Beauty, which is likely a seed company reselection or renaming of the Livingston variety Beauty, is a slightly oblate tomato with a much different growth habit than Eva Purple Ball. If anything, Eva is closest in shape to the few globe shaped old tomatoes such as Globe (both Livingston and Burpee released pink medium tomatoes named globe) that most closely match the shape of Eva Purple Ball.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by nctomatoman

Redfield Beauty, which is likely a seed company reselection or renaming of the Livingston variety Beauty, is a slightly oblate tomato with a much different growth habit than Eva Purple Ball. If anything, Eva is closest in shape to the few globe shaped old tomatoes such as Globe (both Livingston and Burpee released pink medium tomatoes named globe) that most closely match the shape of Eva Purple Ball.

I started answering you Craig,went to fetch a couple of links and poof,lost everything.

I did agree with some of what you posted, but not all of what you posted.

Carolyn, who will be back, if and when she can,when she has late lunch, pays some bills,makes some important phone calls gets caught up here and there and feeds her old cat so that she doesn't try to tear her(my) human sandwich apart,etc.

[travis]

Originally Posted by carolyn137

Bill, I wrote about that in my heirloom tomato book, I'm assuming you have that book somewhere, probably holding up a table leg, but for those who don't have it, here's a link to Google Books with the text of what I wrote.

https://books.google.com/books?id=y4...oville&f=false

I don't have a good answer except to say I wonder how Redfield Beauty found its way to a small village in the Black Forest of Germany.

The correct name is Eva Purple Ball as Joe first co-listed it with me in the 1991 SSE Yearbook, I have no idea who first put that apostrophe in there, and not correct

http://tatianastomatobase.com/wiki/Eva_Purple_Ball

Tania said it was only me who listed it but I'm sure it was Joe who also listed it since I had talked him into it.I had paid for him to be a member thinking he might be interested in some other tomato varieties, but after one year he didn't want to be bothered by any requests and exited left.

Carolyn

Yes, my question was initiated because I remembered you writing that both Redfield Beauty and Eva Purple Ball, among other similarities, shared the white surface mottling and the propensity to drop fruit from their vines (shattering).

The only variety I've ever grown (besides some cherry tomatoes) that drop nearly ripe or fully ripe fruit was Ozark Pink, so I thought maybe this was an infrequent trait.

[nctomatoman]

What I've discovered that is really interesting is that Redfield Beauty seems to be a Hastings Seed Company variety. In their 1890 seed catalog they list it as "Redfield's Beauty" (with the possessive), and state they've been growing it "for four years of testing" - which puts it at 1886 or so. They also list Livingston's Beauty in the catalog. Livingston released "their" Beauty in 1886. Livingston selected Beauty "from his Paragon fields". It isn't out of the realm of possibility that Hastings made a similar selection of around the same time - or perhaps their Beauty is a selection from Livingston's Beauty (though they would have had to rush it to market).

During Michigan State's variety tests, they describe the two as essentially indistinguishable. But Bailey, and later Myers, often said that in their large scale tomato tests; that many tomatoes released as distinct varieties seemed essentially the same as other named varieties. They suspected that renaming went on to increase sales and create "specialties of the house"

In other words, things that go on today went on even at the dawn of the American Seed Companies in efforts to increase business!

[Tormato]

Carolyn,

I'll be concentrating on the varieties bred by both him and his father, along with the 3 heirlooms mentioned above.

I don't think I would have found Joe a bit strange. What I do find a bit strange is that I just bought a Vitamix a few weeks ago, not knowing that Joe had one, or knowing that I'd be starting this thread and reading about him having one.

Gary

[Labradors2]

I think Joe would have fit right in here at Tomatoville!

Linda

[AKmark]

I sell EPB at the markets, along with Momotaro hybrid, which is nearly identical. This year I tried Marizol Purple, and I really liked it, I see market potential with them too